Why current trade restrictions do not stop RMT, and a proposed alternative: the Market License system

[ridleyco]

I like the supplementary quests angle. They would have to involve things that are really horrible for bots to do - for example, things that involve forming parties and accomplishing goals that require communication among actual human beings. Good idea!

[random78998]

Was trying to formulate an idea similar to this earlier today, I really like the solution proposed here! Awesome work.

[jr_batenga]

A very interesting idea @ridleyco, I do hope this catches the eyes of the staff. And I do hope this is a viable option that allows the players to enjoy the game as well as allow IMC to remain profitable.

[senemcem85]

i like Market License idea.. Lets make this things harder for bots: if player didnt complete his all daily dungeon limit (2 + 2 with token = 4) he can only use %5 of amount of silver limit (trade or market)

Every day bots can be reported on dungeons (high risk for bots) even not reported; this making harder gold-selling for bots..

Edit: random dungeon need

[cosx774]

It'd definitely be an easy automatable solution that would get rid of a large proportion of bots.

Since it's automatable - pretty simple as well - it's defo worth doing.

In the end, there's rarely 1 a size fits all solution, u need many filters working at the same time.

This would be a layer that would defo do work.

Ofc though we all know publishers don't actually care about bots, IMC just wanted easy moneys

[thebloodyaugust]

if player didnt complete his all daily dungeon limit (2 + 2 with token = 4) he can only use %5 of amount of silver limit (trade or market)

Thats not a good idea, its one of those ideas where innocent people get caught in the crossfire. There are many players who dislike dungeons.

[YuriYuri]

Bad idea. I don't want to burn out doing a set number of dungeons each day.

[senemcem85]

You have a good point, i agree..

But this is nothing against 1:1 trade restriction's cost (which is already there)
And dungeons are great for Leveling..

[thebloodyaugust]

But this is nothing against 1:1 trade restriction's cost

Yes but if we can stop bots in another method like proposed in the topic perhaps trade restrictions can be lessened or removed

[ridleyco]

For the life of me, I can't figure out how to make anything work without some way of making 1 to 1 trading uneconomical for RMTers. How do you make them hate 1 to 1 without it causing normal players problems, too?

And of course my own solution falls apart if they can just do 1 to 1 easily.

[thebloodyaugust]

And of course my own solution falls apart if they can just do 1 to 1 easily.

Not necessarily it still makes it a pain in the ass to make bots to obtain the silver/items to sell. We would need frequent bot bans in order to maintain its effectiveness though if 1:1 was available. Then that gets into the man power / funding discussion.

[nordiccrayon]

Perhaps limiting 1:1 trading with the same system as the Auction Licenses?

Limit the amount of money they can move, the rarity/level of items tradeable, and # of trades they can make every week.
Maybe make it so players have additional trades per week with long-time (2 Weeks+?) friends and guild members, and I think we're golden.

[ridleyco]

If 1 to 1 was enabled without token restrictions then it would be easy to sell items to players as an RMT. Bot accounts could easily hand any drops they got to a sales account and go from there, or simply trade directly with buyers.

@nordiccrayon
!
That just might do the trick. It might even make 1 to 1 silver trades tolerable, depending on how well the huge walls of dungeon/quest based content slowed down the bots.

[thebloodyaugust]

If 1 to 1 was enabled without token restrictions then it would be easy to sell items to players as an RMT. Bot accounts could easily hand any drops they got to a sales account and go from there, or simply trade directly with buyers.

My bad i was interpreting those restrictions as being on all trading not just the market.

[ridleyco]

It's an interpretation so good that I just included it as a possibility in the OP, lol

[iEden]

It's incredible how your idea could turn into a solid system to slow down these pricks. Good stuff man, that's some out of the box thinking right there.

Sadly i can only give you one like. I'm going to share this topic with some of my friends and mention it here on the forums whenever i can. Hopefully people will show their support and we might have a solution out of this mess.

Thank you for your efforts.

[thebloodyaugust]

Time for phase 2, attempt to get topic on staffs radar.

@Staff_Julie @STAFF_John @STAFF_Ethan @STAFF_Shawn

Please read through this topic and take it into consideration.

[ridleyco]

Heh, I don't usually resort to that. I do think most of them read most of these. Especially and obviously Julie. She's been all over the place since she was brought on.

What the heck, though - time is short. I'll try to summon the mysterious @GM_Erick, too. He's an idea man.

Unrelated, whoa, 10 users, 10 likes? How long can I keep universal agreement going?

[SynysterOne]

Despite not having much to suggest myself, I'm going to poke holes in your suggestion.

• With the suggested system you are preventing low level players from selling potentially really valuable rare items at an appropriate price.

• The amount of movable silver would also have to be adjusted for inflation, and couldn't be universal for every server.

• Players would also need a means of knowing what their current amount of movable silver is.

• Forcing players into any behavior is a no-no. Some people don't like quests. Some don't like grouping. Some don't like dungeons.
  There are even players who legitimately like grinding and will sit in a single mob spawn for 10+ hours straight, and will do solely this to get to cap level.

You would have to set the requirement for any such system as something that EVERY player is going to reach, but will hinder bots/gold sellers. Perhaps something like 10,000 mobs, and 10 bosses killed to unlock the auction house. This gets bots out into the open, and requires that gold sellers even put work into their accounts that will sell items, while only mildly inconveniencing players.
Though this is altogether pointless if gold sellers/buyers aren't caught and banned as no amount of work will stop them if they only have to do it once.

As far as 1:1 trading goes. Just restrict it to no silver trading.
Some people will balk at the idea, but players will find a way. If silver can't be used to buy items, then a commonly used item will be. For example, potions.
If potions aren't universally needed, then enhancement items.
The bottom line being, there IS something that can be substituted for silver.

However, I believe this all to be moot as IMC games real intent is likely just to monetize trading and tax gold sellers.
The only way that will change is if there is a huge communal outcry over it.

Ooops, I didn't intend this to be such a large post.

[Daenerys]

I am going to poke holes in your holes.

With the suggested system you are preventing low level players from selling potentially really valuable rare items at an appropriate price.

While true, those low level players can simply save the rare item until they increase their silver trade cap. It is a mild inconvenience, but I wouldn't say it completely ruins the idea.

The amount of movable silver would also have to be adjusted for inflation, and couldn't be universal for every server.

The cap should be fairly high, @ridleyco's numbers seem a bit too low to work. Although over time the numbers might need to be adjusted for inflation, hopefully that would only be at most one a year and should be easy for devs to do during a maintenance. There should also be no limit once you reach max silver cap. If a bot can reach that level, it will hurt like hell when they get banned.

Players would also need a means of knowing what their current amount of movable silver is.

This I completely agree with. It could be just as easy as adding that info to your inventory below your current silver

Forcing players into any behavior is a no-no. Some people don't like quests. Some don't like grouping. Some don't like dungeons.There are even players who legitimately like grinding and will sit in a single mob spawn for 10+ hours straight, and will do solely this to get to cap level.

This is probably the only hole that I don't think can be fixed. The game already tries to force you down a linear story line though.. it would be nice if there was a way to fix this hole, but I can't think of any.

As far as 1:1 trading goes. Just restrict it to no silver trading
Some people will balk at the idea, but players will find a way.
If silver can't be used to buy items, then a commonly used item will be. For example, potions.
If potions aren't universally needed, then enhancement items.
The bottom line being, there IS something that can be substituted for silver.

And what is to stop gold-sellers from selling potions instead? Restricting silver trading won't solve that problem.