Can anyone tell me what’s wrong with bokor/sadhu/pd3 combination (all INT)? This is my main build but I am being told that it’s not a good build. I am aiming for a hybrid/AOE dps. Thanks
It is very good Transmit Prana nice syn with faster trig of PD skills, PD is BIS for Bokor.
I have no idea why that guy told you like that.
Are you Cleric 2 Bokor 1 Sadhu 3 PD 3 ?
It’s one of the most common Sadhu-PD builds, there is seriously nothing wrong with it. The classes work well together and you have good single and aoe damages.
This is the number 1 Cleric build on iTOS
Thanks guys, I don’t know why I am getting so much grief from my friends on this build. I see 3 AOE attacks and can heal others
It’s because you spent 3 Circles on Sadhu for mainly a flat damage boost for Incineration&Black Death Steam.
Neither Possession nor Astral Body Explosion are good skills, they are simply inferior to Damballa&Effigy.
I have a Bokor3>Sadhu3 and guess whose skills I use less? It’s Sadhu, it’s mainly a damage boost through Transmit Prana and that’s all.
I’m not saying that Sadhu is bad per se, but it is simply inferior compared to Bokor C3.
Another problem your build has is that it lacks reliable short-CD damage.
While Effigy level 5 might look like a good filler, reality is harsh and even with medium tier gear (e.g. lvl 315 unique weapon +16[e.g. Skull Smasher/Heart of Glory], T5-7) it deals only low amounts of damage against lvl 330+ monsters, either because all of them are Dark element or because they have high mdef.
I have said equipment and even my level 16 50% enhancement attributed[i.e. level 100, ~38000 attribute points invested] Effigy only barely manages to kill some of them within 3 ticks.
Within challenge mode, after stage 3 I completely stop using Effigy because it deals no damage to the monsters.
So unless you whale out your character with T10 350 weapon, I doubt Effigy will be able to fulfill the role of stable,low downtime DPS in higher content, leaving you mostly with PD skills and Sadhu skills for damage, which have a lot of downtime (except for Incineration if you have enough debuffs; question is how many points you invested here, though, most people seem to save points by leaving Incineration at a lower level).
I’m not saying the build is crap or weak, but I can understand that some people voice their opinion against it, since it’s mainly built around boosting&utilizing Plague Doctor skills.
@ReportofAusterity do you have a sample build and stat I can take a look at? I am aiming for a PD3 build that is viable for endgame. Thanks
My current relevant stats are:
INT: 462 (5 base+ 239 investment+218 equipment)
matk: 5365-7552 (T5 +17 Skull Smasher with 3x 7* Red Gem)
Effigy level 16, level 100 enhancement attribute = 819% attack
I can’t offer any builds because I’m Bokor3>Kabbalist3,
I was just noting down my experiences on Bokor&Sadhu gameplay to point out why some people might find your build bad/insufficient.
You may try to find someone else in the Intermediate Cleric thread, as there are many things to consider (cards,rotations,debuffs,skill modifiers, personal preferences,etc.) while building your character to be viable& still to your liking.
Oy, listen up here you little ■■■■.
We know you don’t like sadhu, but that’s no justification to outright misrepresent the class.
And it’s rather hypocritical from someone who likes to recommend far weaker builds, like kriv/tao for example.
As for your “arguments”:
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Transmit Prana scales with your min-matk and is therefore not a flat increase.
The argument you’re trying to make is that Transmit Prana’s added soul property dmg ignores skill factors and other dmg multipliers, which means it doesn’t add as much dmg when you do have a strong weapon.
But even that’s only half the story since added soul property also ignores mdef, meaning it’s actually a lot stronger with weaker weapons.
Effigy is a mostly useless skill by your own admission, especially since at pd3 tier you’ll want to prioritize pandemic for incin+bds which alone should kill the majority of enemies already.
Effigy used to be a popular option during pd1 and pd2 days because it works so well with pandemic.
It allowed you to bds, run around to make a poison train and reserve hexing>pandemic>effigy for the next pack of mobs.
But that’s not as much of a thing anymore since effigy has taken a back seat to spreading incin and bds. That and the whole crappy ass range on hexing, that really needs a change tbh.
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Astral Body Explosion has a 9 tick dot that deals 9 ticks of 9.5% of ABE’s dmg each at skill lvl 16.
Meaning it’s a lot stronger then you give it credit for, even if said ticks ignore TP’s added dmg.
It also combines really well with incineration and should dispatch most mobs hit with a TP>ABE+Incin combo even at lower gear levels.
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Possession is also quite strong, at lvl 11 it hits up to 21 times vs 15 targets with a 223% skill factor. (+enhance)
With lvl 6 TP alongside it gains +100,3% of minmatk as soul property dmg to boot.
And add in its inherent cc, which gives it a bit more utility to boot. It’s still one of the best cleric dmg skills.
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Damballa is really powerful ofc.
But it has its downsides just as well, it needs zombies to work well. And zombies don’t always want to walk into its effect, and you won’t always have the ideal amount of zombies either.
Then again Sadhu is a lot weaker to interrupts, but methadone helps counter that quite well.
Might want to swap out bokor1 for priest1 or diev1 ideally, perhaps even cleric3 if you want stronger heal bombs.
Otherwise, it’s fine.
8 Likes
Good point, saddhu is amazing, as bokor, but for now SPR version of bokor os a Lot better then INT, and Will become even more powerfull with the Next patch AoE zombies, ofc just for PVE.
One downside of saddhu is acctualy have to take Full INT status for transmit prana, sp is a issue endgame.
Now i have 2 version of cleric, diev/miko/PD and bokor/pd, i ditch my saddhu because of i really don’t like channeling skills.
I love my diev version, i can make any content of game with her
I see you got here first XD was going to say possession and out of body explosion are both great skills.
The only bad things left about sadhu after the numerous buffs and debuffs are Vashita, OOB auto attacks are meh, and the 0 Def penalty still exists.
The offensive spells are solid though.
2 Likes
Welp. R.I.P. My full INT dark doc. 
it uses your min matk, times it by 0,65/0,68 or 0,975/1,02 (depending on skill level and element of the skill used) and adds it as additional damage to your total damage, it works exactly the same as Blessing and elemental property damage and is thus a “flat damage increase” [as it’s not affected by the enemies defence or other factors that might boost/multiply the damage except the elemental property bonus/-malus].
If you didn’t understand that it’s not my fault, no reason to violate the forum guidelines and issue an ad-hominem attack. The whole post was just to explain why other people might find the build of OP weak/crap/whatever and I explicitly stated it at the end of my post.
Btw, if I didn’t like Sadhu, I would’ve resetted it away from my characters, but I still have 2 Sadhus in my arsenal, just not Sadhu on my main because it wasn’t good enough for said reasons, thus I exchanged it with Bokor.
Zombies are not really a downside, as Damballa is now limited to 8 explosions it seems.
Zombies will always rise again from Damballa if you have at least 3 of them when casting the skill, and 8 explosions during the ~7 seconds the sphere exists is most times more than enough to trigger 8 explosions in total with the reborn zombies taken into account. There are also zombie capsules for perfectionists who want to have max zombies at all times to have the maximum damage.
Directing the zombies is easier than ever, you have 3 skills to get them into Damballa,
Tet Mamak La [worst option due to aiming and animation time but still an option],
Bwa Kayiman [easiest option because you can lead them in there yourselves] and
Summon: Force Attack [ usually the most used because it’s easy to target a nearby monster and make zombies attack it, thus walking into the Damballa AoE and explode]
You make Sadhu sound so powerful,though it isn’t. It’s not bad but I really wouldn’t call it good either, given that it has 20/30 seconds CD time on the main damage skills, and both of them aren’t that good, unless you like ccing with ABEs knockdown and Possessions root.
Reasons are, as you said, that they are vulnerable to cc [both skills, ABE and Possession can be interrupted during cast with staggering/knockback/knockdown] and the damage over time.
ABE deals[at level 16] 1553% base, with full enhancement attribute 2329%. If we calculate your 9 hits a 9,5% of the initial damage (i.e. +85,5%), we get 4320%.
That’s a lot less damage than level 16 Effigy deals with 3 overheats [819%+819%+2579%(average 3,15 times for the 3rd hit)=4217%*1,3(Hexing:Dark multiplier)=5482%] and only “superior” if the enemy is a dark property monster [Effigy will be down to 4111% while ABE is up to 5400%].
If we ignore the setting/casting time of both skills, in the worst scenario[i.e. against a dark property monster] Effigy has 1027% DPS while ABE has 180% DPS.
And about the AoE: while the AoE of Hexing is really small, the AoE of ABE is also pretty limited. It hits 7 medium sized monsters maximum[no idea if it’s affected by AoE attack ratio, maybe I’ll test it later], so if there are more enemies around the larger AoE won’t help you, you’ll still hit only 7 monsters regardless of skilllevel [while Hexings level increase its AoE ratio, the most monsters I got affected in one use were 7, you just have to get them together close enough; 2-4 is always possible with some training].
Possession. The skill is really great and I like using it on my Taoist & on my Druid, but it isn’t as great as one might think it is. If we do the calculation again and use level 11 Possession with full enhancement attribute and Transmit Prana boost [i.e. +102% damage], we get 436% per hit. As the skill hits once every 0,3 seconds and lasts for 6,5 seconds max, we have a total of 22 hits, so 9592% every 20 seconds.
That’s a DPS of ~480%.
Damballa. Let’s be realistic and say we have 4 zombies per Damballa to explode (as you need 1 to use the skill and can use 3 zombie capsules during the 10 seconds CD time and 7 seconds lasting time, ignoring how many zombies will come back after exploding&the possibility of putting Zombify beneath it to make new zombies from dieing enemies).
Level 6 full enhancement attribute has 1357% damage per explosion. As we calculate 4 explosions, the damage is 5428%. That’s a DPS of ~543%. This ignores the possibility to boost the damage with Hexing by 30% and is still higher than Possession.
If we calculate again against dark property it’s 600% DPS [Possession] vs 407% DPS [Damballa] at half capacity.
The AoE of both skills is ~ identical [with Damballa being a little larger], so no remarks to make here.
Comparison: If we use e.g. Druids Carnivory as a comparison, level 6 fully attributed will grant you 312%x25 hits = 7800%. That’s 312% DPS with one Rank.
@Wurmheart I just reach 360 on that character so I have that 1 free rank reset within two months. Can I ask what your main build is?
It’s intended as a wake-up slap/call actually.
It’s literally a Dutch cultural norm to be as brutally direct as possible since we consider that the more honest, civil and time saving way of dealing with such a situation.
I know it isn’t conventional, but I find that it’s usually far more effective at getting the point across than the other option. Which I’ve already tried several times with you anyway to no avail.
Argu thingies:
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Flat increase means it’s an amount that does not change.
Elemental property dmg is still affected by ele res and ele types, meaning it isn’t a static amount even in that case.
And any percentage is by definition not a flat increase either.
I know what you are getting at, I’ve already written that out. You’re just using the wrong term for it.
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I’ve used Damballa plenty of times, the respawn is rng based. You do not always get zombies out of it back, zombie capsules also have a cd and same is true for zombify.
You will not always be capable of reaching 8 explosions due the cd mismatch and rng elements period. Stop misrepresenting this situation.
Tet Malak La ends when a regular zombie reaches it up.
Bwa Kayi ends when damage is taken.
Force attack is by far the best option, but we didn’t have it yet when I tested bokor3/pd out.
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The argument is that I use ABE + Incineration to kill off packs when the other skills are on cd.
Trying to say that it has worse single target dmg than effigy, which usually hits 3-4 enemies at best, doesn’t even begin to counter it.
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And you’ll never be happy with Possession it seems, it has good dmg, good cc, good cd and good range. If possession isn’t good enough to be worth using as an auxiliary AoE then 99% of all cleric skills don’t fit that criterion either.
And its main downside is counteracted by its cc and/or safety zone/methadone, which are easy to do when you get the hang of it.
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No one’s saying Damballa isn’t op or perhaps even the second best cleric dmg skill, but the argument here is about whether or not Sadhu is worth using.
Something which a dmg comparison just isn’t well equipped to tackle.
And you did state:
First off, I think the argument that Sadhu3 is inferior is overstated.
And you would need to compare Transmit Prana (for all spell hits) + Possession + ABE vs Damballa + effigy. Not some partial comparison.
But at the end of the day, both build variants are incredibly strong and well worth using, so I personally don’t see much use in trying to nitpick which is better.
Not exactly decided which is my main yet, but try to aim for a decent enough build that you like to use ofc.
As for cleric builds I have and like:
- Cleric2/Priest1/Sadhu3/PD3, tested both pd variants and liked this one the most.
- Cleric2/Bokor3/Pala1/Kabba1/Zealot2, as a selfish PvE only farming build.
- Cleric2/Diev3/Miko/Priest/Zealot2, as a flexible full spr diev build.
- Cleric2/Krivis3/Druid2/Zealot2, wanted a str based druid. Ended up as a str/spr hybrid.
- Chaplain/Krivis3/Inquisitor, the standard aa build. It’s quite good, just no idea how to properly stat it yet.
2 Likes
Nope.
Krivis is there for melstis primarily to extend zealot buffs, zalciai is also rather decent atm on an spr build since it still gives crit attack.
Possession’s CC is amazing for grouped mobs/party play. Mobs are easy to group in general, then you can keep them in one spot for 6ish seconds, allowing your party to destroy them with aoes.
Possession has good damages. It’s not great, but saying it’s not good either makes no sense. How is an easy 4.5k%+ every 20 seconds with a CC in it not good, seriously ?
The fact is channeled isn’t an issue at all. My Sadhu is never interrupted because Gazing Golem cards exist, aren’t difficult to get, and unless one is an idiot who always tries to use Possession right before the enemy does a knockback/knockdown, there shouldn’t be any issue.
Possession only has a 20s cd and will kill every mobs it traps.
Sadhu has Soul property skills, which are (slightly) effective against most mobs.
The SP cost is almost nonexistent.
Note that I’m not comparing Sadhu to any class. But it’s far from being an average or bad Cleric class. It’s not the best, but it’s definitely one of the most dependable, versatile and useful damage dealers.
And on a side note, I’d like to point out your hypocrisy (not to attack you, but I think you should see it): on Sadhu you claim it’s “long cd” with 20s, “low damages” with 213% for 6.5s every 0.3s + an aoe CC. But Krivis is also 20s cd and only 82% for 38 hits - with mobs always walking out of it - but you always talk super highly of it as if it’s the best.
I find it really hypocritical that you claim Possession’s cd is long but attacking every 24s with a Krivis-Taoist isn’t long. Even though Sadhu’s 20s is only for 3 circles when you’ll have other classes to deal damages, while for KrivTao it’s almost the whole/main rotation of the build.
You cannot say that you’re not biased when you obviously are.
5 Likes
Perhaps it is just my playstyle but I use Tet Mamak La a lot more than the other 2 zombie directing skills. With Bwa Kayiman coming in second and Force attack rarely used (used mostly on bosses and whenever I feel gimmicky with my zealot).
Primary use of the skull is to direct the zombies to a location where there are no monsters, usually to gather them together into a kill zone while they pull in all the monsters along with them. Love this skill so much.
I am trying to use the force attack more but they still ignore it like Tet Mamak La. Bwa Kayiman is my most used skill