Tree of Savior Forum

Tommorw is a new work day

General Discussion
#183

I’m just going to mention that legally speaking they don’t have to do any of the things previously mentioned. So far they followed their contract which you signed upon buying early access and which you must follow every single time you use their provided services.

You bought an early access, which only gives you the right to access (which depends entirely on them to give or restrict) the game. The right of termination, and access itself depends on them, and their own will.

Legally speaking you are owed nothing- that is how it is.

Sadly, I know nothing about management, business or coding/programming… I’m a Penal Law graduate and the little business I had I decided to sleep in class thinking it was in no way going to help me or my life so i can’t really comment on their way of doing things BUT I will say that they could at least have someone post an announcement. It doesn’t cost much to simply post and say “We are aware of the issue and are working on it”.

I also do not know how big of a company IMC is, they are based in South Korea, and I was too lazy to really look into their assets but I’m guessing they have a team even if only for customer relations based in the United States. If that is so, it’s still quite early there and for all you know they are already aware of the situation and the community team is waiting for the higher up “go” to post on the forums.

You guys must remember that the people working on the forums don’t have much rights. They simply pass on the information that was given to them, that information was also “checked” prior to being posted.

Anyway, no need to get all personal on people. This is just a game and we can all do different things on the side. Personally this gives me time to cook dinner so… :slight_smile:

Lastly… about the refunds… This is where I see who is a mature, responsible adult and who isn’t. A responsible adult will read the contract before any purchase… in this very case, what, 1% of the buyers did? You will not get a refund and you are NOT entitled to one. Take responsability for your purchase. Contractual Law is important.

#184

Well then. One week or they’re a past issue to me.
Anyways good times, nice talk and all. Got things to do so don’t get too heated people, lol.
Live and let live. Talk is talk and no one will keep talking if nobody is listening.
GL;HF.

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#185

and honestly i doubt that happens unless u write some big fat complaint

#186

It’d have to be fat indeed.

#187

i actually read something about games in general u never own the right to them u buy a ticket actually to be allowed to enter lol.

#188

Yes, it’s funny how easy it is for companies to make these things happen. It’s also mainly possible because nowadays people are impatient, and more importantly, do not read what they’re getting into before getting into them.

#189

Do you realize there are work turns like 5x1 or 2x1 (work 12h, rest 36) that makes companies able to run 24/7 right? This behavior only proves how small of a company IMC is and how bad organized they are.

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#190

the thing is like many other game companies they Split up… Like Nexon sure they have the same company all over the world however it’s not the same people. they only bought the rights to release under their name and so on.

IMC Us/Eu is not the same company is IMC KR

#191

Sir, you clearly never programmed in your life. Unfortunately something like “writes code for the first time and it works for life” never existed, and probably never will. They’re trying to fix, but those things can take time.

#192

ye lately more and more people are impatient lol. compared to 10 years ago people really were patient

#193

Allow me to correct you on one clear thing:

According to Contract Law, which is in no way Penal Law, when you “sign a contract” (in our case “click the I Agree” button) then all aspects of the current state of the product (good/service) are being agreed upon AS IS.

While buying a car “AS IS” simply means "devoid of any legal suit if anything breaks after you finalize the purchase. This is not a car so let’s not get that confused.

This is, instead, a video game and in this reference of “AS IS” it simply means “In the current state of the game.”

Now. Since the “Current state of the game” was wholly unknown BUT assumed (and yes, in Contract Law anything not clearly defined is considered to be assumed or “interpreted” by the - in our case - purchaser) to be a full Ready For Release game.

That means, but is not limited to, a functional game client that allows you to log in to a game server, a functional game server that allows you to play without interrupted service, and the ability to interact with the game the way it is INTENDED to be done so by the creators. Since none of those three things has been wholly met, nor communicated that they are currently addressing them, then it is now a void contractual agreement.

I graduated Contract Law. You graduated Penal Law. Let’s openly admit that while you specialize in one area I specialize in another and respect those roles accordingly. I mean… neither of us are going to tell a doctor how to do their job, are we?

#194

We lack information on what IMC NA really is as a company and “who” and “what divisions” are part of it. I’m pretty sure they have a tech team but I’m also certain that they are limited in what they are capable of doing and that from time to time they must check in with their S. Korean counter parts who actually programmed the game. After all, it’s probable that they encountered these same issues in South Korea and so it’s easier for IMC NA to get in touch with them directly to understand what causes what.

IMC won’t share with us their ways of doing things so we’re left to debating over things we have no information on besides our own which may not be what they’re following. Especially in programming where depending on who creates or changes a program the pattern may be entirely different. (from my understanding).

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#195

the problem is that as u said the programming they did may not have as per say the correct pattern for them to understand.

in programming it’s time consuming when u need to learn what another person wrote. even if u are a master in the language u need to read and understand everything someone wrote.

#196

10 years ago people were not patient. There were just LESS people. We’re talking about an entire market that was roughly 15 million consumers to a market that is roughly 90 million consumers.

You’re attempting to argue an opinion when you weren’t even there. I was. I remember WoW and you know what they did? They shut their servers down, fixed the issues, and relaunched AND provided people a free month of game time.

Problem was solved. WoW, arguably, - though not by much - had the worst launch of any MMORPG that has ever launched and they came out of it with a high amount of respect and class.

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#197

You’re implying I would disagree while I’m only mentioning my own understanding of it while as you say we’re from two totally different areas. I think you’ll agree with me when I state that Penal Law is less forgiveable, and deeper as to their “interpretations” so I’m not as open minded in my understandings and sometimes it can cause me prejudice I’ll admit.

You’re completely right, but after reading their contract it does seem to me as the very service they are providing is limited. You are given and owed access however they are entitled, and allowed to revoke it at any time for any reason so considering this fact we can safely assume that a temporary down time is not something you could ague to have ground on for a legal matter?

#198

Ah yes! The major complaint from any developer that worked on ESO (well… okay second lol because pay was the major complaint).

Even ESO had a better EA launch than this OVERALL. Overall. They communicated at the least (and had the most aggressive bot/hacker/cheater/exploiter team I’ve ever seen!)

Finally, we agree on something.

#199

You’d have a place to stand on if other mmos didn’t have 24/7 support and the game didn’t already have plenty of tests and time to fix things. So no, they’ve been doing a horrible job so far.

#200

keep it up guys, otherwise i’ll finally reach the end of the posts.

#201

eh no 10 years ago people were patient and we can go as far as 20 years back. people i know now existed 30 years ago… and alot of people i know does lol…

it doesnt matter if there was less people… it’s the current people that lived that long ago is getting more and more impatient…

when wow vanilla launched it had problems for months- cause of the technology we had at that time imo… being patient was a key here…

#202

again u try to impose IMC na/eu is as big lol. ESO only happend because of the major success of the series.

and they did not do a 1 month early? and also it’s not the same anyway lol when other mmo’s not including this does early access it’s 3 days or close and thats after a open beta.

i consider this a premium open beta.