Tree of Savior Forum

Some suggestions about monster cards

#1

I’m bussy but usually i will update this post.

I need help about new ideas to rework normal and legend cards to make them all wierd, usefull and worthy of being leveled.

some idea about what to do with the elemental property cards and those of defense property (like Slash, piercing, etc)?

Change the effect of this red/offensive cards to:

  1. Corrupted: Summons damage +[:star:/2]%, magical damage +[:star:/3]%.

  2. Deadborn: +[:star:] % additional damage to enemies inflicted with slow status.

  3. Helgasercle: +[:star:] % additional damage to enemies inflicted with burn status.

I won’t change effects and color from Froster Lord because it’s good for support builds to give some CC in some situations like ET.

Change the effect of this blue/defensive cards to:

  1. Denoptic: HP from summons +[:star:/2]%, magical defense +[:star:/2]%.

  2. Gray Golem: HP from summons +[:star:/2]%, physical defense +[:star:/2]%.

Change the effect of this green/stat cards to:

Change the effect of this purple/utility cards to:

  1. Lepus: Summons atk. speed +[:star:/2]%. (it also affects the speed (not the cooldown) of the second and third summoning skills).

  2. Bepraspion: Basic attacks have [:star:/3]% chance of applying as multiple hits (It stacks with “double attack” from scouts. I think that it could be better to AA builds instead of Marnox cards).

  3. Marnox: Max. critical chance +[:star:/3]% (all grades). (I saw in a korean patch that they will remove the “Max. critical chance +10% (all grades)” bonus from leather armor sets, so with this Marnox cards and the new Demon Lord Marnox card posted below, people can reach 75% critical chance (but they have to get the critical rate to achive that, in addition to overcome the critical chance reductions by critical resistance from enemys)).

  4. Poata: Casting time -[:star:]% (maybe people preffer less casting time than “quick cast” but use other class than chronomancer (this will give them a chance to be better magical DPSs). I dont think that it is pretty good but it’s worthy to be tested and think about it).

  5. Mushcaria: skills cooldown -[:star:/2]% (it could be good for support builds).

  6. Basilisk: Increases the range of Magic circles by [:star:*2/3]% (It can be pretty good for some support skills like barrier and make It easier to some wizard builds too).

  7. Gazing Golem: When attacking has [:star:/3]% to apply burn status for 6 second. (In my opinion, pain barrier should be only for swordman class. In this way, more skills will be used (methadone, invulnerable, paraclitus time) and not everyone will have the possibility to resist knockback, knockdown and root effects).

I think that IMC should change the damage dealt by burn, poisoning and bleed from cards (make it based on INT and STR) and increase it (It could be a great choice for PD builds if they do it). currently people use them only to be able to use their respective red cards, not because of their damages.

Change the effect of this legend cards to:

  1. Demon Lord Blut: ​Damage taken -[:star:*3]%. Physical and magical attack increased by +[:star:]% of your physical and magic defenses. (This will make it easier to tank builds).

  2. Velcoffer: Every hit has [:star:*2,5]% chance to apply a def. break debuff and remove one beneficial effect of rank 2 and below from the enemy (def. break debuff: -[:star:/2]% magical and physical deff). (debuff duration: 3s)(Max. Number of stacks: 5)(debuff rank 1)(it will be good to wugushi, PD and AA builds).

  3. Ignas: [:star:*5]% chance per critical attack of entering stealth state for 6 seconds. Next attack while under stealth state has increased damage by +[:star:*1,5]%, ignore [:star:*1,5]% defenses and [:star:*3] of damage reductions from the enemy. (The second effect also affects cloaking, annihilation attribute, etc)(If this card has not increased damage, people won’t use It. Currently you need to do a crítical hit, and then you have a 50% chances at 10 :star: of entering stealth state that only makes you invisible during 6 seconds… I considered that this needed a boost).

  4. Demon Lord Marnox: Max. critical chance +[:star:*1,5]% (all grades). At lvl 5 :star:: Every critical hit deals 50% of it’s damage but has increased number of hits by 1. (This doesn’t Increase the damage directly but gives a new line of damage that will be affected by critical attack, blessed, elemental property attacks, etc one more time ((for example: a critical “grind cutter” (from hackapell) will hit 10 times (instead of 5). Every hit will deal 50% of it’s damage. Apparently the damage wont change because the number of hits doubles, but the skill will be boosted by secondary effects/stats one more time for each new hit). It will be good for AA builds and classes with many multihits skills (like BM, fencer, taoist, etc)).

  5. Demon Lord Froster Lord: Reduces the difference between the min. and max. attack of summons by [:star:*10]% and increase the summons damage, HP and atk. speed +[:star:*1,5]%.

  6. Wastrel: skills cooldown -[:star:*1,5]%. Each healing skill that exceeds the maximum HP will apply a cumulative shield equivalent to the amount of HP exceeded (Max. Shield HP: [:star:*3]% Max. HP of who carries the buff). (shield’ duration: 10 seconds)(buff rank 3). (Finally a legend card for healing supports).

  7. Demon Lord Zaura: Stamina consumition while mounting -[:star:*2]%. Increase your mov. speed and damage after dash while mounting (increased effects depends on :star: and the time you’ve been running).
    2 seconds: m.spd +[:star:] damage +[:star:*1,5]
    4 seconds: m.spd +[:star:*2] damage +[:star:*3]
    (Buff duration 15 seconds)(Buff rank 3)

I would like to know your opinion (in addition to the opinion of other players):

@STAFF_Amy
@STAFF_Yuri
@STAFF_Bob

I need to give more ideas about new cards to make it easier to them (i mean, in this way they won’t have to think about new cards). If you have some ideas, tell me and i will probably add it to the list!! :grin:

#2

Okay so first, mixing Property Attack or Property Defense cards would create a new BiS card.

Imagine Kite Moor with even 1 of those Property Defense cards.

Now as for combining cards in general, there are a lot of cards we are missing and new bosses being created all the time without cards. Instead of freeing up existing cards it would be better to add new cards with new effects.

The Sequoia idea is good but currently it exists as a half and half of Denoptic, and some other card which add flat defenses. You’re suggesting to make it instead a Zaura/Nuaele split. Which is far more useful, and better for the game, but at that point just do something about Denoptic and the physical defense one.

I typically do not like pointless change (nerfs) that could effect others build, but those specific blue cards are just factually worse than % defenses so it’s fine, but I think the right answer is to just add more. Which they were doing, and then they stopped and started making everything a legend card.

1 Like
#3

I proposed that about sequoia because leather armors. I think that Zaura and Nuaelle cards should exists in addition to the new sequoia card that i proposed (not instead).

Anyway, i’m agree with both opinions :joy: i mean, i think that new “normal” monster cards should be created based on new boss monsters, but actually there are a lot of cards that are useless (the game could be the same without this cards) and i think this need a rework too. Same with the skill gems from last classes, etc… But this post is about cards :sweat_smile:

Thx for your colaboration :smiley: :3

#4

I think cards need too be addressed to a point but I think that Sequoia card is too good for a boss that is more common than the basic demon lords from colored albums.

I think the reason we haven’t seen this as its basically an enhanced version of Centaurus. I do expect we’ll see it eventually though and… Ktos just got 2 new demon lords I think? So we might already have it on the way.

Other card changes I’d like would be to review cards that are stuck in the dark ages like
Bepraspion attack speed + [:star:]
Muscharia sp recovery + [:star:*6]
things that are so weak as to never be viable. I’d also move Gorkas from green to purple as looting chance is a ‘support/other’ stat and thats what purple cards are typically for.

~Azura Skyy

1 Like
#5

I proposed new ideas about bepraspion and lepus (i have not good ideas about the cards with sp/hp recovery because people recover all with potions (people dont depend on sp/hp recovery stats, maybe IMC should remove some potions from the game or change the rules about their cooldowns or effects. If they won’t change It, sp/hp recovery stats will be useless in the game)). i thought about shorten the recovery cycle, but the problem is the same plus the other effects about shorten it (like foods or summon servant).

#6

What I would suggest about monster cards:

  1. allow only one of the same kind equipped within the 3 slots (e.g. one Unicorn + one Moa + one Vubbe Fighter, no longer 2 or 3 Unicorn cards) to improve the card value and possible combination diversity

  2. double the base value of all percentage-based cards (e.g. Unicorn card will add +20% damage against dark property monsters)

  3. change the flat values on Red, Blue and Purple cards to percentage boosts

Red:
Rexipher & Deadborn (+3% critical attack/magic critical attack per star)
Helgasercle (+1.5% magic attack per star)

Blue:
Denoptic (+1% magic defense per star)
Grey Golem (+1% physical defense per star)
Armaos (10% chance of generating [★*1% Maximum HP] Shield for 10 sec when attacked)

Purple:
Lepus (+2% attack speed per star when equipped with a one-handed melee weapon)
Bebraspion (+1.5% attack speed per star when equipped with a two-handed melee weapon)

melee weapon refers to sword/mace/spear/rapier/dagger weapon types,
as missile type weapon is generally delayed by reloading ammunition, thus should be excluded from the card effect

  1. Change the slash/pierce/strike defense cards

Gorgon (-2% damage taken from strike type attacks per star)
Scorpio (-2% damage taken from pierce type attacks per star)
Glackuman (-2% damage taken from slash type attacks per star)
into damage reduction cards (e.g. -20% damage from strike type attacks on a 10 star Gorgon card),
change Sequoia card effect

Sequoia (-2% damage taken from missile type attacks per star) to reduce missile attack damage

and do the same for the property resistance cards

Yonazolem (-2% damage taken from holy property attacks per star)
Bramble (-2% damage taken from earth property attacks per star)
Saltisster (-2% damage taken from ice property attacks per star)
Shanyim (-2% damage taken from lightning property attacks per star)
Colimencia (-2% damage taken from poison property attacks per star)
Sparnasman (-2% damage taken from dark property attacks per star)
Flamidus (-2% damage taken from fire property attacks per star)
(e.g. a 10 star Yonazolem card will reduce Holy property damage by 20%)

  1. Move some cards:

Centaurus,Yeti,Nepenthes,Molich,Velorchard,Specter of Deceit > Green cards
Wood Spirit,Froster Lord> Purple cards
Gaigalas,Merregina,Fire Lord,Necroventer,Yekub,Honeypin,Lithorex > Red Cards
Stone Whale > Blue cards

  1. change the property attack cards

Gaigalas, (+2% damage with earth property magic attacks per star)
Merregina, (+2% damage with ice property magic attacks per star)
Fire Lord, (+2% damage with fire property magic attacks per star)
Necroventer, (+2% damage with dark property magic attacks per star)
Yekub, (+2% damage with holy property magic attacks per star)
Honeypin, (+2% damage with poison property magic attacks per star)
Lithorex (+2% damage with lightning property magic attacks per star)
into percentage damage boost cards
(e.g. a 10 star Yekub card will boost Holy property magic damage by 20%)

  1. change the attack boost cards when equipping a certain weapon type

Rajatoad, (+1% damage with pierce type attacks per star)
Red Vubbe Fighter (+1% damage with strike type attacks per star )
Sparnas (+1% damage with missile type attacks per star )
Gremlin (+1% damage with slash type attacks per star )
to deal additional damage with certain attack types instead(e.g. a 10 star Rajatoad card will boost damage when using pierce type attacks by 10%)

and change Master Genie card effect

Master Genie (+0.5% damage with missile and slash type attacks per star)

2 Likes
#7

I don’t think its necessary to change card effects and force people to equip different cards. If they change card effects to be unique/useful enough the market will cater to it.

1 Like
#8

I’d hate to see gorkas being moved to purple. Using 3x gorkas and 3x tutu is so nice for HG farmer builds, and I’d miss the +30% inv weight a lot.

1 Like
#9

Never thought about that. It’s definitely more of a purple in its effect but Tutu is probably why they left it green.

Agreed. Leave Gorkas green.

1 Like
#10

Make a card -star% cast time please

1 Like
#11

remember that this post is not to make the game easier (in my opinion (i’m not a god) @Umineko you should think more about the consequences your ideas would have. think about how easy velcoffer, CMs, etc would be with specific cards if they use your idea. Anyway, you gave some good ideas too, i have to read it more times and think about it), it is to renew it in a logical way with the idea of ​​change useless cards into useful cards (even if it was only for a specific class, I think it would be better than the existence of a card nobody thinks about use it)

Anyway, thanks you all for your collaboration

I added the “- casting time” idea (i dont know if it is really usefull but i thought that It could help in some builds (maybe you preffer to use other class instead chronomancer even if you get less “- casting time”)(maybe IMC should think about add the “casting time” to some “base stat” (like atk.speed in DEX, casting time in SPR or INT for example)).

#12

Well all you can get out of my idea is 30% additional damage boost, and that is only if you have all 3 cards optimized for the enemy.
Currently the maximum is +30%, after implementing my changes the maximum would be +60%.

The difference is really small for many Classes that already provide additional damage modifiers (e.g. Barbarian, Pied Piper, Oracle, Zealot,etc.), and Classes like Musketeer would still hit cap damage anyway (999k).
The way my suggestion works is that you can always have a small damage modifier for any of your skills active by combining your red cards in a clever way (e.g. an Inquisitor can combine a card to boost damage against demons with a card that improves slash damage and a card that improves strike damage), while it prevents brainless 3x same card stacking as it’s ± the way it works currently.

Even on the blue cards, the only thing you will see is Zaura or Nuaele for invested characters,since you can stack them 3 times. With the new system I proposed, you can only use one Zaura/Nuaele, so you either stack both + another card or check out the other cards that can provide more benefits (e.g. attack type damage reduction).
Who knows, some people might even do completely without Zaura/Nuaele if the the other cards are actually useful.

With the new Episode 11+ content supposedly becoming harder, it would be a good time to make card equipment more strategic. I bet with my system people would even exchange cards for silver more often than currently to gain advantages, providing a better silver sink and more use to the cards which are currently just bad.

1 Like
#13

My bad, i didnt understand you last time. You said that cards shouldn’t be stackable and that’s why they should receive that increased effects too. I think that it’s a really great idea but this will give us less build alternatives… Moreover, people will have to lvl up more cards and have all in their inventory… I think as @ianmattheis : I don’t think its necessary to change card effects and force people to equip different cards.

We need change effects and new effects.

Anyway, thanks for your collaboration. I was thinking a lot about your idea (in fact, I modified the post based on your idea but I just deleted everything because what i said…).

#14

Just dropping some random thought i had about the system.

Equipping
The first copy of an equipped card will receive +50% effect power, based on card scaling factor, as bonus. (Ex: 3 Blut Cards = +35 CON, 2 Blut Cards + 1 Ellaganos Card = +25 CON / +15 DEX).

Property Damage/Resistance
As a whole this is a mechanic that is rather uninteresting and people don’t care that much about it (aside few AA and heavy multihit builds that still make more use of raw stats), instead of being just a flat addition it can be factored as fake P/MAtk for skills that match the property. Having +85 Fire Property Damage for a Pyromancer means it has +85 MAtk on all the class skills, for a Cryomancer this only applies in the existing way as post calculated damage. This same logic can be used for defense as +200 Fire Property Resistance can be factored as +200 extra MDef towards Meteor and 0 bonus against Electrocute.

If it isn’t clear from that the point here is to have options for specific build paths that have more room for strategy and gamble, class combinations like Warlock/Shadowmancer/Bokor get Dark Property Damage to the peak but will fall behind on the elemental advantage.

Hybrid Cards

Cards that have +A stat / +B stat, commonly seen in the Green Group. The issue with these cards is that they offer half value on two stats while the system allows players to pick two pure version cards instead which is uninteresting. Some builds can be really heavy on a particular stat as others can have equal value for two stats, for that matter it is better to have the hybrid card sum higher than a pure version as stats have different weights.

Red Group

Weapon Based cards - Moved to Purple Group. Grants +★8 Property Damage. Sparnas changed to Missile - Bow, Mothstem changed to Missile - Gun.
Chapparition/Glass Mole - Also increases SP potion efficiency by +10% (per card, doesn’t receive bonus).
Master Genie - Reworked, grants +★*10 Psychokinesis Property Damage.


Blue Group

Gray Golem/Denoptic - Value increased from +★10 to +★40. Too low to be an option when Nuaele and Zaura have % value.
Sequoia - Value increased from +★5 to +★25.
Golem/Progola - Increases HP potion efficiency by +10%, Reduces P/M damage received by +★% for 6s when using it. By being temporary versions of Nuaele and Zaura it is pointless to pick them, however it can be changed into a true counterpart to Glass Mole/Chapparition as a straight damage reduction card. The balancing point here is how it can be a bad choice if players invest in armor while it may be a great survivability tool for those that don’t have it.
Property Resistance - Value increased from +★10 to +★50.


Green Group

Pure Stat cards - Value increased from +★1 to +★1.5.
Duo Stat cards - Value increased from +★0.5 to +★1.
Lavenzard - Reworked, +3 STR/INT for 6s after using HP/SP potion and +10% HP/SP potion effectiveness (per card). It feels like these cards only purpose is to expand the effectiveness of their potions and nothing else, this on its own is quite boring.
Rafene - Reworked, +★ INT/STR. Better change the focus completely since Pajauta is a better version of Rafene.


Purple Group

Nepenthes - Value increased HP from +★90 to +★110 and SP from +★15 to +★20, add +★ Stamina to the mix.
Cyclops - Reworked and moved to Green Group. Stamina +★, all stats +★0.6 for 10s when using stamina pills.
Ravinepede - Reworked and moved to Blue Group. Stamina pills restore +5 Stamina, reduces incoming damage by +★/2 for 10s when stamina pills.
Manticen - Reworked and moved to Blue Group. Grants +★2% Evasion and +2 Movement Speed (per card) when using Stamina Pills.
Neop - Reworked and moved to Red Group, grants +★8 Missile - Cannon Property Damage.
Rikaus - Reworked and moved to Red Group, grants +★10 Property-less Damage. Applies to all magic damage that doesn’t have property such as Energy Bolt, Magic Missile, etc.
Bebraspion - Attack Speed +★%. Pointless to split them between weapon groups.
Lepus - Attack Speed +★10.
Velorchard/Molich/Basilisk/Stone Whale - Moved to Blue Group.
Magburk - Reworked, ★% chance of recovering 0.5% SP when attacked by Small size monsters. While SP refund per race is good it can be troublesome when certain skills can force monster into other races, additionally this effect slot is vacant.
Nuodai - Reworked, Freezing resistance +★2%. It’s quite pointless to have a card for hybrid debuff resistance when other base debuffs aren’t covered.

I don’t think it’s interesting to have summon oriented cards for now, after all they’re only 3 classes (ignoring the Baubas AFK farming episode). Though this can be done in the future if this mechanic is explored further.

1 Like
#15

we need more % effects instead of flat effects, a lot of cards are really bad, because the flat effects are no longer useful because of the stat changes in re:build