Tree of Savior Forum

Shinobi design is quite big joke/mistake when you look at it's class change quest

General Discussion
#1

in quest you are told that Shinobi is suppose to be trained stealthy fast assassin. You kill you target and hide so enemies can’t detect you. Even during quest you must kill monster, hide from other enemies for 10 seconds and avoid taking damage (repeat that x50 times)

But when you look at ToS Shinobi kit…

it’s just totally something else

  • throwing kunais
  • shadow clones (that actually make you weaker: it drains stamina, you take more damage and you lose evasion)
  • firebombs and even more firebombs
  • trick with swapping body with wood log

what is this? Naruto? Rank 9 hidden class will be Hokage?

where is the invisibility/cloaking skill? No I don’t count that attribute for Katon no Justu… it’s just 8 second max invisibility for ability that have 29 second cooldown. It’s PATHETIC JOKE when you compare it to Scout’s cloaking (you can be perm invis if you don’t attack and when duration ends you just go invis again). No bonus damage to next attack, no bonus movement speed. Not to mention that you have to spend silver to get that invisibility part and you need to max that attribute for full duration. Katon no Jutsu and Miji no Justsu should be fused and Shinobi should get better version of Scout cloaking, after all Shinobi is rank8, hidden class

where is the fast stealthy/assassin like killing skill? Flashy kunai throwing in all direction (not to mention that you MUST pick Hoplite class for pierce damage debuff to make kunai throw bursty skill)? Flashy explosive bombs? that’s not stealthy at all.
Shinobi have no attribute/passive that make it deal more damage with backstab (all weapons) or passive that boost damage with daggers or swords. There is no skill about “appear behind you enemy, stab it in butt … I mean back and kill it hard (kill it dead :^)) and then vanish in shadows”. There is no skills or attribute with poison attack so even if you aren’t able to eliminate you target you make it die slowly from poison while you hide

Why does archer with Scout and Rogue classes feel more like assassin/ninja/shinobi than actual Shinobi class? Why even ranged class have such tools/features?

Shinobi class design is a joke in ToS and the more I read about that class the more I learn that’s the most bugged/WIP/unfinished/badly designed class in ToS (second place is Sorc with bland playstyle and 0 synergy with other class spells or other wizard classes beside linker).

@STAFF_Max @STAFF_Ethan @STAFF_Amy @STAFF_John @STAFF_Ines @STAFF_No

do you guys have any plans for Shinobi? rework? buffs? bugS fixing? adding new skills? because atm it’s the worst hidden class in whole game. And it’s sad since it’s pain in the ass to unlock that class (that cursed yellow flower or farming Colifly Stamen that have 2% drop rate -_-) and it have synergy ONLY with spear based swordsman classes (mostly hoplite C2)

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#2

I think you ment to post this rant in the Swordman section.

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#3

Yes, obviously it was Naruto that made up what a Ninja is, Kunai is a tool made up in narut too, not a chance any of these ideas excisted before naruto, not at all. And throwing firebombs, yes thats from naruto too, never done before. Log trick was first introduces in nadurto aswell, you figured them out, good job :wink:

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#4

that Naruto part is just comparison.

but the thread is about the fact that this class don’t feels like shinobi/ninja. Sure kunais and firebombs are legit fightning tools of this type of warrior but where is the stealthy party that’s specially pointed in class change quest?

Shinobi/Ninja ain’t front row fighters but more like specialized unit that’s all about scouting, infiltration and assassination and your main priority is to be not detected.

From Wikipedia:

“A ninja (忍者?) or shinobi (忍び?) was a covert agent or mercenary in feudal Japan. The functions of the ninja included espionage, sabotage, infiltration, assassination and guerrilla warfare.”

“So-called ninjutsu techniques, in short are the skills of shinobi-no-jutsu and shinobijutsu, which have the aims of ensuring that one’s opponent does not know of one’s existence, and for which there was special training”

ToS Shinobi is all about throwing kunais, firebombs and being 24/7 visible to all enemies like some kind of front line mindless brute warrior. Where are the espionage (spying), sabotage, infiltration, assassination and guerrilla warfare parts of Shinobi/Ninja? Why all those tools were given to 2 archers classes?

#5

By that logic

Naruto = Godzilla
Naruto = Ninja
Ninja = Godzilla

WHY ISN’T SHINOBI A GIANT PLASMA BREATHING MONSTER!!!

God my life is ruined. lol

4 Likes
#6

And how awesome wouldnt that be! But in all seriousness, the way he first expressed himself just triggered me.

But in general i guess i agree,i dont think shinobi itself doesnt really fit too well in swordsman tree, What ninja is supposed to do is what archer branch already can build into.

#7

Honestly if they adjusted how much extra damage clones make you take i think it could be a really strong class. I find its just the multiplied damage you take holding it back.

#8

I’m sorry bby didn’t want to achieve this. Hugs? No hard feelings now? ;_;

yup. And that’s the most confusing design in ToS. I bet that every single person that came to ToS after playing RO or any other generic MMO with thief/assassin/ninja class with build in invisibility … just facepalmed when realized that there is no melee class with such mechanics (invisibility and backstabbing) in ToS but instead they gave it all to ranged class (such thing is always avoided in most mmos since it’s hard to deal in PvP with ranged class that can kite you and go invisibility). I understand tons of crit bonuses coming from Rogue since it fits archer archetype to always aim into vital points/head and deal heavy damage but invisibility and backstabbing? wut? O_o

#9

I have a friend who made a Shinobi and I don’t see him anymore. What a ninja

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#10

LOL

20 characrtesrss

#11

Hummm. So OP took Shinobi class without knowing what it was about? Cool!

#12

For those that don’t know daggers = melee

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#13

But to be fair archer isnt a “Melee class”, they were just given the option to do melee, but eh, i guess thats nitpicking.

Gosh darnit it, this thread makes me want to make yet another alt, now i want a rogue :confused:

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#14

well rouge has melee orientation around it. Beyond that hackapell seems like it will be bringing more melee skills from its description.

#15

If Shinobi didn’t have the drawback it gets from using Bushin, it’d be a VERY strong class considering that you could also stack Doppel alongside it. Granted it’d be a situational DPS type character who’s more a bosser than a sustained DPS, but the power would be there.

That said, I think I would have rather Shinobi actually being an Archer class (Ninja’s used bows quite popularly, seriously), and would have rather the Swordsman secret class be a sort of Holy Crusader who has magic damage potential and was more AOE based. But that’s just me.

#16

except that would fall under cleric like paladin and zealot

#17

Ironically Paladin’s only magic attack is Barrier, yet it gets two skills that increase magic DPS, both in -Magic Def and -All Property Resistance. Ech.

In any case yeah. Maybe a sword dancer esque class or something with dancing sword attacks and spell sword and junk. I dunno. Shinobi is okay, but it feels fisted into the Swordie line of things.

#18

Maybe something along the lines of sword dancer but i don’t ever see the swordsman tree getting magic. Unless its like a bomb or something that does magic damage by no spell themed skills.

I don’t know im still fine with shinobi in swordy. There are other agile type classes in the swords man tree like corsair and fencer from a fluff point of view.

#19

This sht is too funny to me for some reason. He said rank 9 Hokage

#20

I guess that Shinobi class was suppose to be solution for lack of assassin/thief class in ToS (as RO veteran player I was super disappointed when I fist time checked what classes are available in ToS)… but IMC messed up:

  • they gave pseudo steal mechanic form Corsair (we still don’t know the % values of steal chance from Jolly Rogger)
  • they gave pseudo bonus to attacking from behind for Corsair… BUT sadly it’s just bonus for dagger ONLY instead of “ALL ATTACKS” not to mention that this attribute would better work for shinobi actually if it’s suppose to be ninja/assassin class.
  • they didn’t gave proper invisibility skill for Ninja/Shinobi class or at least didn’t even bothered to copy-paste Cloaking from Scout
  • the only burst/deadly attack skill (aka tool to assassinate target fas) is actually double edge sword that makes Shinobi take huge amount of damage
  • Shinobi scales ONLY with spears/pierce damage. There is no skill in Shinobi kit that works with Swords/Slash damage that fits more thief/assassin/ninja archetype. So if you picked barb, highlander or doppel you will have 0 synergy, specially with incoming barbarian changes - cleave will debuff enemies and make them take more damage from slash attacks)

it’s like Shinobi was super rushed class without no proper vision and design that’s why it have literally 2 similar skills (Katon and Mijin) with even 2 same attributes (super short invisibility that require tons of silver to spend first)

just see. You gonna quote me on this in a year or two when IMC will announce rank 9 classes :^) JK