Tree of Savior Forum

Player Retention Mechanics

Hardly anybody participated in open world gvg at all. It was an irritating mechanic that encouraged people to NOT join guilds because joining a guild meant being in wars that you had zero control over and provided zero benefits.

Everyone was very happy when it went away and people could safely put their towers up in covenient locations and that players could join guilds without fear of getting ganked for no reason or benefits while questing. There really were no complaints at the time it was changed.

That too was never a retention mechanic anyway. Just a poorly thought out gameplay mechanic. I agree that we need better gameplay mechanics, I would just really prefer it if people would make threads for those mechanics specifically so that IMC can see the discussions about those mechanics in one place. You know, like a properly moderated forum that keeps things nicely organised and discussion relevant.

These are solid suggestions.

In particular I like Revelation Online’s mechanic for rewarding high level players that play with low level players. It gives merit-pts that can be used to buy things in the merit-point shop. It encourages socialising between new players and existing longterm players, and we all know that a strong reason people continue to play any MMO is due to the relationships created within the game. Encouraging existing players to meet new players is a good retention mechanic.

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The title and topic I created is Retention Mechanics.

Not Retention.

Reading comprehension is a useful life skill. As is brevity.

[quote]A game need content, be it low, mid or high level, a company shouldn’t be looking to fish new players and throw out old ones like rot fish, that is bad business.
[/quote]

It’s actually called player churn. And it’s a very normal fact of every title. Players churn in, players churn out, players go to other things, players come check out things. You can not stop player churn, it happens, it is inevitable and can only be delayed. People don’t stay with one thing forever. There are other games, other commitments, other distractions. Retention mechanics are part of the aim to delay churn long enough for the gap between churns and new content boosts to not cripple player populations.

Great. We have a other player accusing another about bad reading skills.

The ā€œLearn to readā€ insult is childish and is already a regular part of some lonely rabbit’s copy and paste argument list.

Retention mechanics?..

How about making a client that works 100% of the time and doesn’t RNG disconnect players, and doesn’t require a redownload every week.

Making a working game is the first step to having players play the game…

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Hypothetically lets say you gave a new player everything. Instant max level, best gear, anything. How many people will you think stick around?


:thinking:

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@Awoooo I kinda want to say, I like login events but there’s a small problem with them:

It turns into a bad thing if it makes you feel you’re ā€œlosingā€ something by not being able to login some day or another. It’s not a huge problem but needs to have some thinking to not give this feeling to the user.

IMO when you stick the ā€œyou lose something by not doing Xā€ on the user and the user quits then most likely the user won’t come back ( ? ) - this is true at least with me.

But if there’s a balance and it gets it right it turns into a great thing because the ā€œI’m already online, I’ll play a bit moreā€ effect.

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OK I’m still going to talk about retention mechanics as though they are anything that could potentially hold new players to the game.

Most players just starting out don’t really know what’s to come. From what I’ve seen in forums, of anybody posting their early quit experiences, they tend to drop out of the game between Crystal Mines and Tenet Garden.

I think it’s from lack of exploration, the game guides you through a straight-line path through most of the game (there’s a couple splits here and there but the choice to go in either direction is not easily noticeable). Besides the start of the game where you can play from Orsha or from Klaip.

Like, the game seems boring because all the enemies you’ve fought thus far have been tailored to your level, so you always feel like you can’t diverge from the right path. Up to Tenet Garden, there’s 3 points where you can accidentally step into a 100+ map, so you die and immediately turn around. Most players are not going to find the spot in Crystal Mines, nor are they going to stumble into the other two maps. In the case of RO, exploration was a huge part of the game. The world map was easy to read in a directional sense, but was also unlabeled so you could easily walk into any especially dangerous area. Most of the towns were disconnected and if you had to class up somewhere, you were most likely going to trudge through a few dangerous maps. The world map, while unreadable, still had art detailing the landscape, and you could take a pretty good guess where the dungeons were, or how to traverse a large area without having to mouse over every freakin’ map, reading all the portal names so you didn’t fall to any misdirection.

So this aspect of the game could be fixed with some new world map art. If IMC wanted to go a step further:

  • A lot of the world map layout, because of the portal direction in each map, is a mess to navigate. So a lot of the maps need to either have their portals re-positioned, or the maps themselves need to be relocated. If I exit eastward from one map, I should be entering the west side of the next map.
  • The world map needs to drop the mouse-over popups and change them to click, and confirm (for teleport), so the world map doesn’t frame trap you.
  • The world map art needs to reflect the true positions of each zone.

A Step Further:
*Most sub lvl 50 maps are almost totally safe to afk in. That’s fine for the first 3, but past Crystal Mines, there should be more dangers introduced to the players. Panto Spearman is a pass. We need more of Panto Spearman.

A Step Further:

  • There are currently 330 levels in game, which is to increase to 600 levels with rank 10 (correct me if I’m wrong). Killing monsters exclusively in a range of ±20 levels to the player is such a tiny demograph that it does not make sense. This window needs to be expanded.
  • The added damage that players receive from higher level monsters needs to be removed. Gating the content to the player’s level sucks. This also heavily influences players willingness to explore.
  • The reduced XP gain for lower level monsters (it’s 1/4 or 25% XP gain) needs to be removed. If players enjoy farming in a lower level map, they should not be impeded by this XP reduction. It doesn’t work as a bot deterrent, bots have no perception of time, and the botters running those bots have no perception of the time spent botting. The rate that required-XP-per-level raises is already an indirect influence to keep killing same-level monsters. I don’t know how higher level xp gains are behaving right now, so I can’t say.
  • Along with all of this, I do not think monsters should display their level. The ā€œrecommended levelā€ stamp attached to every map is good enough. It might also be good to remove monsters’ health bars.

As for bringing back old players, a ton of them quit after warring between guilds had died. We need an open world (or zone restricted) guild on guild pvp incentive.

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I can agree with that.

Obviously it’s something that would be tweaked with data though. With the preference being towards whatever actually results in keeping more players.

With things like this the data can show a slightly different thing to people’s feelings. Same goes for things like the gacha cubes. Everyone says hardly anybody buys them, but I’m willing to bet that the data on IMC’s side shows that people buy 1 or 2 to see if they’ll get lucky. Meaning that while there aren’t many costumes in game to show that people buy those cubes, they still are being bought by a significant enough number of people to warrant having them.

The same kind of mistakes can occur between the players and the data for retention mechanics. It’s always quite hard to tell with the information from only one side of the fence.

I’d like to add too that it would be so pretty if the game shown thumbnails of maps you’re checking on world maps. I love when we’re checking a place we need to go or check randomly the maps nearby for a style that attracts me. But with this they would really need to focus on exploration and make more maps useful.

As for Open PvP/PvP, let’s be direct. Every time I talked with GMs in-game and asked about TBL they said that a lot of players asks for more TBL. Most people just want any form of PvP, be it open pvp, pvp map, more TBL, more GvG or a new concept. A form that you can participate whenever you want, no restrictions, just let everyone kill each other, no secrets to make this work, it’s simply fun. (Of course there’s the class balance issue and bugs etc but players will still play and still have fun even with these issues, as long they can PvP in the first place and the issues are handled and classes balanced over time.)

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An open-use arena would be good for everybody currently in game, but I think the warring guilds was the whole game for some players.
RO supported warring events every weekend. I think something needs to be built for those players.

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and then the player realize the main content = saalus run, 3x rush/solo , ET?(in this case best gear, no point at all).

gvg = crash fest + fps triggering monitor punch
pvp = wuttttt over 6month + for a mount :joy:

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They should have actually went with the open PVP channel suggestions ages ago. No rewards or penalty on deaths from other players and what ever floats people’s boats.

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I’d say anything involving trying to being in new players or help incentivise people to play more frequently should wait until the current kToS update is done.
My biggest issue with this game is it feels like a chore to play because all your damage is from skills meaning you tend to have a spike in power when you rank up but minimal growth after that. As a result you have to spend hours grinding/farming/questing just to get a brief moment of power.
(Plus trade locking, no team storage and stuff is a big ā– ā– ā– ā–  you to casual players (and with this having the casual mmorpg feel to it is a big fuck up…))
This is a game that has a lot of potential, but is locked away due to tokens and some idiotic things. (Which are finally being improved) Potential to be a long running MMORPG (Especially if they implement a new class tree or a 3rd branch later down the line.) Only if they improve upon the existing mechanics.
Edit: For some reason it refuses to censor the second ā– ā– ā– ā– , yet it’ll censor it if i type it elsewhere. Forum be glitched.

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Guys, retention system is way too easy to exploit, especially if you can create million accounts without any restriction.

You can make tool to daily auto-login – grab reward – auto logout with all these accs and share your profit later or even RMT. It would be real nightmare to prevent such activity.

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But there are ways to prevent that, such as limited-time/untradable rewards like exp tomes or something like this. If you give valuable things too much it will trigger the ā€œi’m losing something by not playing feelingsā€ too ><

char bind junks like wat they usualy give us from events. then occasionally some good ā– ā– ā– ā–  like shinning gold anvil , untradeable practo lul, heck even costume box that giv char bind costume will do

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Grand Chase had something very simple and nice:

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After they release mobile this topic will actually resurface because you simply can’t have a game on that platform without doing this because it is expected. I personally hate it myself and think they are absolutely psychologically depressing forcing people to login daily or else losing some long standing reward. It is crappy but inevitable to not have something considering the future of this game is heading.

As for what to give it’s like there’s only a certain number of things anyways that they already give for events so no point in even listing.

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In my opinion, events by itself are already some kind of retention system but with constantly changing rules and rewards.

In order to obtain your daily reward, you have to do some various things and these things are changed times to times. So, events are just more complicated retention system.

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They are repelling people xD
When you are forced to do something it sounds like work.
And work is punishment. :lion_face:

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