Tree of Savior Forum

Petition. A permanent ban for buyers of silver/items on the black market. Vote pls)

General Discussion
#22

Earn it, there is no content in this game that can be considered challenging outside earth tower. The best gear is from earth tower anyways. If they figured out how to bypass trade limitations i revoke what i have said. The only thing keeping you from progress is you.

Other people progressing faster than you has little to no impact on your overall game-play. We hardly even have PvP implemented currently. It is simply envy because you see someone getting something quicker or easier than you and salt begins to build.

Gold will always be in demand, so there will always be people lined up with the supply. In games where there is no trading, gold sites and RMTraders offer services where they use your account and earn you whatever you paid for. There is no stopping it.

#23

Fair enough, i didnt play EVERY game out thereā€¦ tree of savior might just not be the MOST archaic.

#24

You canā€™t really distinguish elaborate gold sellers from friends gifting something.

See I know several players on my server for years. Doesnā€™t mean that we play this single player game together, however should someone need something off the other a trade window would simply open. Most communication is of course also not ingame since we use teamspeak.

All this does is selling full accounts that are botted up, rested and if they survive they will be sold off with tons of silvers and xp to boot.

Not the buyers make the gold-sellers spam. The missing spam protection and world filtering is what lets them spam.

See WoW has RMT since but I donā€™t remember gold-spammers there the last years. I wonder why.

That bots create the inflation is also far-fetched. The majority of silver is generated by the masses and that ainā€™t the bots. Bots are little machines that will probably sit around 100k silver per hour. So you have like 6 bots equalling what a corsair pushes out per hour etc. Hyperinflation is caused by lack of silver sinks and when the first attributes are fully maxed there is literally no need for silver anymore. So after that no more silver sink for you.

#25

You still dont understand how the inflation works.

When a player BUYS a bulk amount of gold that is impossible for him to farm himself in a short span of time and then goes and buys all the high level recipes with this gold this creates inflation.

I dont know how to spell it out any easier its such a simple concept, saying its far fetched is rediculous because thats just how it is in games and the real world. Like i can google some articles on hyper inflation for youā€¦ ?

Also you are utterly underestimating how many bots there are and how much gold they have. There is at least 500 bots to any one server minimum. They are offering for sale hundreds of millions of silver. Ill try be clear here but look right, when someone has vast amount of wealth (more then any normal player can farm in any reasonable time) and BUYS all the rarest items in an economy what do you think happens ?

The price goes upā€¦

Also its not hard at all to track these people. (found some in 3 seconds while writing this post)

Now all i have to do is see if these obvious idiots have their piles of junk bought and ban them. Your between friends thing doesnt count sorry because the game is designed to NOT have silver traded between friends, you want to give your buddy silver you do it with gold / silver bars and talt. OTHERWISE you are just as bad as the morons buying it as you are jacking up the price of items on the market artificially.

The easiest example of the hyper inflation at work is Gladiator bandā€¦ its is over 12 MILLION now for the recipeā€¦ like lol what ? If i farm up 12 million by hand. This is gonna take me 1-2 weeks or MORE. If im a casual player the item is already long out of any grasp i had.

Now some gold buy comes along and buys the 12 million streight up and clearly this is exactly what they have been doing as the prices are just going up and up and up as more and more idiots buy it for the outrageous prices before it.

Now i spend 2 weeks farming the silver spending impossibly long hours doing it and only it, not doing a single other things for a hundred hours to get that 12 million.

In that time the gold buyers have already bought gbands over and over every day for the past 2 weeks i was farming and when i have my 12 million and go to buy itā€¦ OH SH1T its NOW 24 million Raaaage quitā€¦ This all sinking in at all ?

3 Likes
#26

Youā€™re still not understanding that the bots do not generate the majority of the silver. So what 500 bots are active per server which btw is a number you took right out of your dark corners. Could be three times that or even half that. Their generation per hour is bad and is bad in any game. They arenā€™t sophisticated enough to play as efficiently as humans could for the most part.

So they will be stuck somewhere at 100k silver per hour or so. Almost every activity you do bar the completely low level ones yields more than that by at least a factor of 2 and you have at any given time significantly more players than bots online.

So just because the minority is online 24/7 doesnā€™t make them the cause of inflation.

Yes select few can buy gladiator bands due to silver farming of bots, but that certainly isnā€™t touching the economic. There are enough ppl around I know that earned a multitude of 13 mil. Heck my pardoner made a million per day for weeks straight just standing afk.

The prices are ultimately going up because people have more and more and more silver to spare. At least the wealthy ones. So if you canā€™t farm the silver for the gladi band is because the inflation outpaces your generation - blame the lack of silver sink for that and nothing else.

Btw if I need silver I can ask my friend to give me some spare goods that everyone has sitting around. We have several venoms, ardes, karachas and other stuff that can still be sold for silver and wouldnā€™t be a problem to reimburse way later or even not at all. If I donā€™t use that method I can just ask him to buy stuff from the market aswell.

Btw 12 million takes around 25 hours of straight up grinding.

#27
  1. Bot horder purchases items from dozens of non-buyers.
  2. Mixes in gold buyer purchases.
  3. IMC would not be able to ban anyone other than the seller, as they run the risk of banning someone who did not purchase silver.
  4. Silver buyer wins, silver seller starts back from circle 1 (kek)

Wish people would actually start thinking like criminals instead of police on the back foot. These techniques have been in practice in real-world money laundering for decades and the only way to stop them was infiltration by undercover officers, wiretaps, etc. None of that is going to work here, you have to think progressivelyā€¦

Target the bots by making it impossible to auto in-game, add a fricking Anti-cheat that can log running programs interacting with the game client so you footprint bot programs (and ban people using themā€¦)

1 Like
#28

100,000 * 500 = 50,000,000 silver per hour

500 is just rough estimation but the bot competition is vast so letā€™s say there are 2500 bots in one server

Just how rekt the economy is just by RMT?

Bots still hurt the economy even if your assumption thinks that its effectivity is that of 1/4 of the server economy

They are the source of heavy lags in the server too (SEA Server Telsiai is absolutely lagless and smooth because the bots are gone and shout is very clean)

#29

Its clear that simple logic escapes you dude, OBVIOUSLY bots do not generate the majority of the silver, BUT THEY GENERATE LARGE SWATHS OF SILVER WHICH IS FUNNELED INTO INDIVIDUAL ACCOUNTS WHICH BUY UP THE HIGH END ITEMS.

Look im going to do something maybe you understand, here is some players and their gold.

player 1: 100silver
player 2: 100silver
player 3: 1,000,000silver
player 4: 100silver
player 5: 100silver

Which one of these guys has more buying power ?

Now players 1,2,4 and 5 SURRRRRE they can go out and farm that 1 million silver to have the same amount of buying power, but guess whatā€¦ Player 3 just whipped out his credit card and continued buying sh1t up on the marketā€¦By the time those other players have their legitimatly farmed 1 million silver inflation has already raised the cost of all the things due to him (player 3) buying up all the supplyā€¦

Like did you goto school ? How is something so simple escaping you. You cannot argue against this pal, it IS FACT proven by real world economics for hundreds of years, this is just how it worksā€¦

1 Like
#30

I read the answers above and I want to say a few words: Bots every day earn millions of silver, perhaps the total number has long exceeded one billion (I think this is a very real picture). Naturally, this leads to huge inflation in the game and those players who do not buy gold on the black market, and just play this game for fun encounter, they can not afford to buy basic things necessary for a comfortable game. And even if they suddenly save up for the necessary thing, even buying gold through official channels (I mean selling Tokens), it will take them a very long time a permanent farm or they will spend hundreds of dollars more than players buying gold on the black market. This makes a huge imbalance in the game and stopping playing honestly people feel comfortable. Add to this the constant spam (and it always will be, until the sale of silver), a lot of bots (especially when the game became F2P) and most importantly - the company IMC loses hundreds of thousands of dollars they would have earned if players buy gold through the official store. As we can see - selling silver hurts everyone, even those who buy the silver (spam, bots on the locations, the price of basic things). The release of this story in my opinion is the same: it is a permanent ban players who buy silver. If there is no demand for the purchase of silver (and only fools will invest real money in the account, which in a minimum time will be banned forever), there will be no proposals for the sale of silver. This process simply will not fit. Bots most likely you can ban by IP, usually they all hang on one. Thank you to those who have read) And Yes, now in Topic thereā€™s a vote) Please vote) Have Fun)

#31

I donā€™t say that bots are good or anything just that they are not the driving force behind inflation.

@ackadacka20 You can type it out how often you want, but youā€™re simply wrong about this. I already said that a couple of high value recipes were of course sold to ppl that bought silver, but the majority will still go to people that earned the silver themself.
Selling stuff is effectively funneling silver into your own account and high playtime will yield more results. Dont be sad because you want something that is out of your league

#32

Out of my league ? lel i already farmed every decent item in the game apart from agvara cannon which hasnt dropped for me yet. But i have every other legendary recipe and multiples of some of them nowā€¦

#33

What if the silver came from a legit source, for arguement say

Person A spend a week and farmed 1mil, but then his cat was sick and he has no money, so he sold his friend, Person B the 1mil silver for 20 bucks so he can buy his cat some medicine

He sold this by buying 1mil silver of item off the market and handing it to Person B, Person B handed him cash (or bank transaction)

Should we ban both of them?
I really donā€™t see a problem like this, and sometimes perma ban can absolutely destory the game

P.S if someone is found as RMT and bot (such as spamming website etc), they should be perma banned, yes

#34

This is not going anywhere.

No sane game company is going to punish the players(gold buyers) who will most likely buy huge amounts of TP, when it becomes available.

Perma ban a gold buyer, bye bye customer with obviously a high purchase power.

The gold buyers are the target market of IMC.

#35

But you are wrong, blizzard regularly bans gold buyers for the past 10 yearsā€¦Not to mention diablo 2 players back in the day.

RO and maplestory banned buyers aswell, along with path of exile and the list goes onā€¦

You know why they do it ? Because its a win win for the company. It helps keep the integrity of the games economy in check and the retards that actually do go and buy the gold are the exact same retards who will buy another copy of the game and buy the silver all over again.

#36

Blizzard does not need their money. Blizzard has a ton of money. Not really logical to use Blizzard as an example.

I have played RO for 5 years. Whatever ban they make, either for bots or RMT instances, are all for show only. They just do that to have a token example.

Just enjoy the game as it is. You are seem to be investing too much devotion to it. Stop getting your higher maslow needs from a game.

#37

what ? what is higher maslow ?

I like to play games where i feel the playing field is even, donā€™t you ?

#38

lol) If goldbuyers can buy silver 4 1m about 6$ (4 my server from spambots) and tokens prize now about 450-500 silver Token is 3$. IMC sell it about 18$ (from FAQ). So i have a question: Where go all real money from players if players can buy silver and premium less cheaper? (i think 60-70% of players needs only Silver and Tokens from real Shop). No money - game fust die, coz no money 4 have ppl who works on this game. It`s easy)

Problem: Goldsellers (not goldbuyers).
The solution to the problem: permaban 4 goldbuyers, coz no money from this game in black market - no goldbuyers. If permaban only goldsellers - they easy make new acc and after 10 hour can sell next 1-2m for 6$.

From the above, we can see exactly what the buyers are ruining the economy of the game, their behavior by encouraging sellers of silver to the high attractiveness of this game for them. Cut off the cash flow to the sellers and all will disappear. Now, this game is a lot of money, and where money - always a lot of wishing to receive them.

P.S. Sry 4 my English)

#39

Iā€™d rather delete forever the character that received the silver, itā€™s much more evil and a better example I belive. Permaban on sellers is a given tough.

#40

I think this will also be able to help. But while the administration does not punish the people who buy silver - less spam/bots will not. You may want to use a gradual punishment: first time deleting a character and just bought silver. For repeated violation - permaban. :smiling_imp:

And really, i want to buy silver cheaper too, but donā€™t do it, coz i want to make this game better. But if this goes on - I canā€™t control myself) :sunglasses: