Hiya. Im planning on going Doppelsoeldner for 1 rank before becoming a Templar and i was wondering if i could ask a few questions regarding their skills.
The classes im going is Swordsman>Peltasta>Hoplite>Hoplite>Hoplite>Doppelsoeldner>Templar
i read somewhere that cyclone is a must and is pretty much worth maxing but the rest of their skills i don’t know a lot about. the one im most interested in is Deeds of Valor.
So i saw Deeds of Valor reduces DEF while boosting ATK and also boosts Attack Speed. so how much of a difference does the less DEF over more ATK really make? does it only effect Phyical DEF or also Magic DEF?. and how does the Attack Speed work on the skill is it a Fixed boost when casting or does it get faster as hit. and lastly is it worth maxing this skill?
is Mordschlag worth maxing? and if not maxing these what is it good to put the points in Double Pay earn or Punish?
Yep, Cyclone is what makes a Doppelsoldner a true Doppelsoldner.
The duration is only 4.5 seconds (which looks weak in paper), but in 1 second, you can deliver 2 hits (so around 9 hits in total 4.5 seconds). It has overheat as well, so you can deal at least 18 x (844 + your patk). Multiple that amount by 1.5 if you have level 50 damage attribute. Not to mention if most of your hits are critical hit (considering you gain bonus 150 critical rate from Hoplite c3 lv 15 Finestra).
Both pdef and mdef iirc.
Less pdef isn’t a problem if you have high evasion because you can simply dodge all attacks with ease (but that also means you might not have the chance to get hit by your enemies in order to stack the bonus damage with Deeds of Valor).
Less mdef is a problem especially if you have small HP pool. However, if you have party to back you up, it’s not a big deal.
IMO, Deeds of Valor is best to be used in grinding against melee mobs, and bossfight.
The damage scales badly and it’s hard to aim it in PvP if you are not close enough to your enemy. However, it has knockdown effect. But I personally won’t recommend it because you already have Bash and Umbo Blow for knockdown. Both of them also have short cooldown and overheat.
Double Pay Earn of course.
Punish is only usable if your enemy gets knockdown. The thing is, if you succeed in knocking down your enemy, anyone would prefer to immediately use Cyclone, not Punish.
I was going to use quite similar build and I wonder if peltasta c1 is enough for tanking, or you will have serious problems protecting your party with just c1?
Also how Double Pay Earn works? If it is level 1 and you use it on monster with 100 HP and then kill it will you get double exp/loot? And will extra damage recieved nerf remain even after the monster is defeated? Basically, is there any reason to level up it past level 3?
Also, while using cyclone/stabbing how buffs like concentration work? Is only 1 stack consumed or are 9 stacks consumed? I’ve heard that while using skills only 1 stack of buffs like this is consumed so I wonder if it’s true and how much actual damage would be dealt.
What are good hoplite skills besides finestra and stabbing? It seems spear throw is strong, pierce can be strong against big enemies. Spear linge lvl 1 is nice due to pierce damage bugg. But what about long stride and synchro thrusting? Are there any uses for this scills, or are they simply outclassed?
Same question about dragoon skills, which are stronger and why?
Depends on what kind of build you want to use. If you want to go for offensive tank, then Peltasta c1 is enough. Swashbuckling at lv 5 can lure 11 mobs (that is already a huge amount for most cases in PvE).
If you want to focus solely on tanking, then by all means go for Peltasta c3. Faster dungeon and grinding = time efficient.
You use Double Pay lv 1, fight an enemy with 100 HP, you hit it once and kill it, you get double exp and the enemy will have double drop rate.
You use Double Pay lv 1, fight an enemy with 100 HP, you hit it twice and kill it, the effect won’t apply.
9 stacks will be consumed if you use Cyclone because Concentration buffs every single hit you deliver to your enemies. Multi hit skills will consume a lot of Concentration stacks. That’s why people said that Concentration scales badly at late game and prefer GungHo.
Spear Throw is one of the best skill you can get from Hoplite. When you use Swashbuckling and you get surrounded by mobs, you can spam Spear Throw below your feet or near the mobs.
Spear Lunge is enough at lv 1 just as you said.
Synchro Thrusting is good at lv 1 if you use pierce attacks that often.
Long Stride is a complete garbage. Long casting time & animation = big turnoff. Easily avoided.
Dragontooth, 6 hits @716 damage, 17 secs cd
Serpentine, 5 hits @926 damage, 20 secs cd
Gae Bulg, 1 hit @3812 damage, 30 secs cd
Dragon Soar, 4 or 5 hits (I forgot) @834 damage, 15 secs cd
Dragon’s skills except Gae Bulg got buffed from recent patches. Now they have more hit counts.
All of them are strong, but I have mixed feelings about Gae Bulg. If you decide to take Gae Bulg, then you must force yourself to take it all the way to max level or it doesn’t worth anything at all. It is one of the few skills from Sworsdman that has highest burst damage. It may be useful to kill enemies who try to run away in PvP. Gae Bulg at lv 5 can also 1 shot enemy with HP around 10k and below (assuming you have around 1k patk from STR and gears).
However, if you compare the damage output of Gae Bulg with the rest of the skills :
Dragontooth deals 4296 damage
Serpentine deals 4630 damage
Dragon Soar deals 3336-4170 damage (I forgot how many hits it has now)
So personally, I prefer Dragoon Tooth, Dragon Soar, and Serpentine in terms of usefulness and damage output.
About dragoon skills, isn’t it better to get 1 lvl Gae Bulg to get those 2% buffs+very high base damage and get 4 levels at Dragon Soar? Or does number of hits scale with level?
Another question about double pay earn: if your ally kills an enemy with 1 hit instead, will you still get a bonus?
And how it works with multihit skills? Are they also considered as several hits? And the last question, if it works on bosses? I know some of this questions are quite silly, but I still want to confirm my thoughs)
Suggestion about Gung Ho seems legit. I tried to avoid it at first since defense decrease looked too big comparing to damage bonus. But thinking about it, at high levels it is insignificant, while damage buff really matter, since it is Patk and not just bonus damage like concentrate. Still, I think that putting 5 points in concentrate and 3 points in Gung Ho is a good idea, while taking 2 points from pain barrier in order to get 1221 bonus damage from concentrate and even more from Gung Ho.
And lastly, I’ve just noticed that dragoon has 2-hand spear mastery which increases damage against large mosters by 4% per attr and against bosses per 2% per point. Korean wiki states that it has 100 levels (so 400%more damage vs big monsters and 200% vs bosses). Sounds pretty terryfying, did I misunderstood the description?
EDIT: it seems, this attibute is most probably about skill which is not yet introduced, I missed the fact that it has linked unknown skill.
Are you sure it has 100 levels? Can you give me the link?
But if is true, then I don’t think it is that terrifying. It only applies against large type enemies and bosses anyway. That is absolutely a great addition for DPS Swordsman in PvE aspects.
Do you know Musketeer? They can deal 50-99k damage easily with only 25 seconds cooldown. If stuff like that is possible, I don’t think that 400% & 200% bonus damage is considered OP. It’s actually great and makes people to be more interested in Swordsman.
Depends on what kind of build you are going for.
If you took Hoplite, then by all means go for Doppel-Dragoon.
If you took Cataphract, you can’t go for Doppelsoldner because Cyclone is unusable in mounted state.
Also, what about Thrust? It seems to be quite a decent autoattack replacer, since there are no other is this build. I’m not sure but I think there would be windows when all skills are on CD, and those occasional thrusts can become a decent addition to DPS. My first idea was to go 1 thrust, 3 bash, 3 gung ho, 5 concentrate and 3 pain barrier or 4 concentrate 4 paing barrier. But I wonder if those 1-2 additional seconds on pain barrier worth more then possible autoattack filler.
I agree that it is not OP at all if it’s just for one skill. I though at first that it will passively improve all the damage dealt. And what about musketeer, I saw the vid, they deal such a damage only to monsters much weaker then them. Sure, they can oneshot a monster in earth tower every 25 seconds, but in PvP they are not that strong. Also there are swell body “nerf” from thaumaturge, which can be combined pretty well with Dragoon. I only wonder, if it doubles current and max HP of a target or simply adds a max HP to current HP. If latter, it can easily be used to oneshot targets with low enough HP. Still, such an attribute on one of the new skills would definitely become a good addition to Dragoon skillset.
Thanks for the reply, would be glad to heat about swell body as well. Also, what do you think about double priest with stone skin? It’s basically 100% uptime. I can’t imagine how such a party can lose to anything but full mages party. Not only insane block rate, but also lots of heal and 4 revives.
Assume one of those priests is full DEX and another full SRP, add there full INT linker c3 and full INT thauma c3, apply all stat buffs swap INT and CON and you get an insane party with everyone having 60k+ health, over 1k crit resistance and full INT, DEX and SPR. Sounds weird for me. Finally, add here full STR QS c3(or basically any archer) and the other party would be doomed. Even AoE spells won’t help against 60k HPs with 2 healers.
I wonder why nobody did something like that yet. Sounds like an unbeatable team.
And the last question, is Pain Barrier shared through link? If it is, then you can swap QS for a swordie and such a party would even become immune to CC most of the time (PD + Pain Barrier). This way it will be nerfed hard or become party standard, which is not sounds good for me.
the best classes at swordman are with highlander c2-c3 and doppel c2 and equipped with 2 hands sword. the rest of the classes, attack damage is not pretty enough and considered as bad.
So, if I use Concentrate lvl 3 (8 stacks) + 1 Cyclone (around 9 hits) will the buff end?
I have this doubt, because I watch on some videos people dealing more than 11 hits with Concentrate (they aren’t Swordsman C2 or C3) and the skill only ended after 45 seconds.
The effect will disappear once you’ve used up all your hits.
At level 5, the max amount of hits you can achieve is 11 hits.
If you already hit 11 times, then that’s it.
However, if you still have some hits left when it’s already 45 seconds, then the effect will also disappear.
I’m not sure if IMC have changed the skill, but that’s how it works before.
Oh dang, how could I forget.
An activation of a skill counts as “one hit” in Concentrate.
So level 5 Concentration would last for 11 times Cyclone, no matter how many hit it deals.
this helped me understand the doppelsoeldner skills a lot better