Tree of Savior Forum

Math: rank 8 int users vs spirit users (priest brainstorming)

Class and Rank Cleric
#1

So, yet another class rank, yet another +10% for int users.

I brainstormed a bit about int and spirit users, and I set 3 table for example:

  • all the 3 stat build doesn’t have any extra points, and the level set is 280 to evade any tinkering about new level cap (even if extra levels are gonna make int even better, since you will have more points to allocate). Also, I have NOT added the roughtly 20 free points that we gain for statue / questing, couz I honestly don’t know the exact number.

  • http://www.tosbase.com/tools/stat-calculator/build/9ap16l34wi/

This is what I suggest to int users that want to run ET, honestly I love 1 con 1 int balance (my Diev is builded in this way for example). At lvl 280 with 139 in con & 140 in int you have 178 con 283 int

This is as soon as you enter rank 8. 178 con 300 int (10% burst ofc, plus all the stats points that you will want to put in int in further levels).

This is a “balanced” build (at least imo) for a priest spirit user. I have allocated “only” 116 point in con and 163 in spirit, (couz u know spirit is the worst stat in this game since it doesn’t scale with ranks -.-) to finish at 150 clean con and 211 spirit at lvl 280. This is the priest alt that i’m currently working on and I like this stat balance for ET.

NOW. I’m not sure if spirit is really worth it anymore, with the blessing buff going int you lose so little and you gain so much basically everywhere else. Even now, a C2 P3 Krivis 1 PD 1 int build is already playable to a point that I would not call it “out of meta” anymore.

You are a way better cleric with int build, you gain incineration, your mass heal will scale better. The trade is stone skin, basically, and I think // fear will be worth it.

Entering rank 8, give a worst int:con ratio (139:140) over the spirit:con (116:163) ratio that I did in this example, you still have 100 MORE POINTS in INT.

If rank 8 doesn’t give some kind of boost again to spirit clerics, I honestly believe there will be the BIG risk of a lot of people rerolling // quitting (we NEED stat reset guys…)

I’m starting to work on an int priest to push at least at rank 4 just in case, at this point I honestly think I’m not gonna regret it :frowning:

Priest, Math on the new blessing
#2

INT will always be superior if you like dps.

Don’t forget Krivis1 zalciai scales with SPR too. Reducing enemy (worldboss, boss) crit resist helps your archers a lot.

I disagree, SPR is not the worst stat in-game.
INT boosts just magic damage. SPR gives extra sp and sp regen, and grants you status effect resistance too, however plague doc covers. SPR magic defence increase is bad. INT is just more desirable since it increases dps directly. If I’d ever go full support (no dps) I’d stat CON and SPR, but ToS doesn’t require full supports.

It’d be best to spreadsheet/graph SPR vs INT scaling breakpoint of blessing.

#3

And HERE there is another big problem.

An Int Cleric will NEVER finish sp given very little (one lamia around?) and a decent rotation of pots, and who play int cleric class know that perfectly.

So what is the overall income of spirit over int? magic defense and that’s it?

I’m not talking of DPS, I have always played full sup and that’s about all I care, and I’m talking about a sup cleric.

the only lose that I’m gonna (kinda) regret would be zaicai scaling, but everything else?

The better scaling of ALL your heals plus the possibility to open to incineration over zaicai/stone skin is already kinda interesting. With another, let’s say, 50 lvls and int scaling 10% more?

I’m focusing about an hardcore support POV (I play support since Burning crusade, and I played 3 years as a priest in wow inside a top 50 eu international guild in raid progress, so trust me I’m kinda dedicated in that role).

It’s just math. Int scaling 10%/rank just snowball, plus sp regen is so useless for cleric class overall that I’m not sure, from a cleric pov, when they talk about sp regen, even given int builds, if they troll me or not xP

That said, what will come in rank 8 will be game (stat?) changing. Priest is basically the only class in the whole class support theme that scale with int (plus zaicai) and they start to need a LOT more support, at least imo.

edit: I would like to do a break even point for rank 8 int priest vs spirit priest, but it’s too early given that we don’t know how many stat points we will have at that level.

#4

Um… Guys, Stone Skin wants to have a talk with you.

4 Likes
#5

Maybe that’s just me, but I found really stupid to have a net loss of 1/3 of a stat ONLY because stone skin stack with that (dumb) stat.

You give up so much (heal, burst, any open int rank) just for one skill? Druid 3 / kabba 2 / PD 2 must have srly bad int scaling skills to keep us into spirit. OR let’s hope oracle 3/ new rank 8 are gonna work nicely with spirit, that was my point.

Even then, losing 100 more stat points for a stat that does to the cleric tree basically nothing given how sp regen is useless for us is pathetic AND bad design at the same time.

They are, basically, forced to give to any spirit skill a much better scaling just to “counter” this game design choice, wich make me think about the stat scaling design in the 1st place.

#6

Incinerate is an offensive skill. Full supports aren’t needed in ToS. You speak of full support yet you mention burst and dps. This is confusing. Edit2: it doesn’t matter what you do, since by being a cleric you are a support just because you have heal.

Support/dps hybrids are more desirable because they help clear.

Yes, the SPR regen bonus is just as it is, a bonus. Mass heal scales with %max HP of your target and your SPR + INT. Stone skin scales greatly with SPR. Heal tiles scale with INT, and 5%target max HP per tile.

I don’t get why you would get priest3 with stone skin if you go full int, just for the extra blessing? Even a full support full CON is possible. If a priest is alive, the party can be brought back to live forever.

EDIT: every stat in ToS scales bad except CON. CON is best stat.
EDIT3: please don’t underestimate the value of a high SPR zalciai (+ monstrance dex bonus) for archer dps on mobs.

2 Likes
#7

Mass heal scale better with int (couz point allocated in int are +80% then the points allocated in spirit), carpet scale ONLY with int, blessing there is gonna be the srly risk to be close to a breakeven point at rank 8.

ATM PD spirit priest are kinda wasting 5 points in they’re build since, let’s be honest, 4/5 bloodletting 1/5 fumigate is all you need in pve contest. Kabbalist is even worst, since it’s basically there “only” for ein sof.

I’m not talking about dps skills couz I don’t want to “support” or I’m goingout of topic, I’m talking about “lost” of points to allocate atm on a rank 7 class, and that’s HEAVILY sub optmial imo.

Atm spirit rank 7 priest use 10/15 of is class points, and we are talking about rank SEVEN, not a worst scaling of zalcai in krivis 1.

It’s not such a bad point, isn’t it?

We NEED sinergies at rank 8 on at LEAST one class, or I don’t see why you should stay spirit.

#8

Yes, INT will give more value to mass heal due to rank %INT bonus. All heals scales with target %HP so they remain viable even on High hp targets.

PD healing factor is OK to use on your party member who will take the most hits, and damage.

Ein Sof is very nice for SP hungry classes such as fletcher, sorcerer, scout3, bokor heffigy spammer, etc. Revenged 7fold is OK for 1 hit mitigation.

I understand you’d like to know about the most optimal stat build. If you like dps, INT is better. Just upgrade your dps attribute on skills.

#9

Inquisitor and Daoshi/Taoist will be R8 Classes. =))

#10

I don’t want to DPS, I would like to be a spirit priest that does NOT waste 5 points out of 15 on a rank SEVEN class, either I would like to not have ALL the worst scaling skills aside, basically, stone skin.

I hope my point is a bit more clear now, I think you fail too fast in the “int is a dps stat, so if you want to do that go for it”, I’m talking about game design not “sup” vs “dps”, and atm I think that the design of spirit as a stat is quite fu***ed up =(

#11

this pretty much say it’s all In a really smart way <3

Stone skill vs all

#12

Yes, stat design is bad. Stats provide too little for their investment. Only CON is acceptable.

I don’t know whether the devs will decide to change stats, however they are slowly adding %stat scaling on buffs such as Blessing and Concentrate (swordie buff).

Right now supports will have to decide whether they’d like to invest heavily into INT or heavily into SPR depending on your preference of Stone Skin, Zalciai, heal tiles, etc. Blessing bonus will have a breaking point, and INT will likely win in the end at high rank.

1 Like
#13

The SPR status resistance at ¬ lvl 200.

SPRstatusresistance.png761×405 12.9 KB

#14

You need 3x the int for blessing to give more than spr.

Rank 10 is only 2x int.

#15

Here’s the graph. SPR vs INT blessing damage, with 170 base blessing damage from bless lvl 15 + attribute max. EDIT: blessing lvl 15 of course.

BlessSPRvsINT.png1260×706 36.5 KB

About end end end game.
600 INT, rank 10 = 1696 INT = 644.98 Blessing Damage.
600 SPR = 899 SPR = 925.26 Blessing Damage.
So decide if you’d value 280.28 damage difference at lvl ~600, rank 10 (disregarding SPR extra regen bonuses, stat resist, etc).

1 Like
#16

Still, it’s just ~one~ skill (okay, two, including Stone Skin).

Having int opens the possibilities of going the DPS-support route, which can only mean one thing: more damaging spells.

644.98 + [insert imaginary damage from several skill combos]
or
925.26 + [whack-a-mole]

SPR wins Blessing-wise, I can’t disagree, but INT is always an option.

#17

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

#18

Yes. I’d definitely recommend SPR for full full buffbot support such as Priest3 Cler2/Krivis Oracle(2). If you take any good multi-hit damage skill, even just incinerate (plague doc), INT will give you more damage.

#19

just sharing: Power Buffer-Healer build

cleric2>priest3>krivis>plague doctor with full SPR i see no problem at all.
im a full support anyway, not aiming for highest dps :japanese_goblin:

low damage? nah. i just use cafrisun set and use blessing to do the work and im good.

P.S - regarding about low hp, im using head accessories with +hp and full plate set if doing mission/dungeon runs. for solo. only use cafrisun