Market restrictions - How should they change?

[Awoooo]

Ok IMC, some of your staff have expressed agreement a few times now that the market restrictions are a problem and changes need to happen. So let’s totally have a friendly and civil discussion about that. This thread will go really well. /s

The market restrictions in ToS are really, really, really strong. They’re so strong in fact it makes the game impossible to play without getting a token, which, for the average player, is not possible because of the market restrictions.

Why do the market restrictions exist? You say because of bots, but I don’t entirely accept that answer. I’m pretty sure that people at IMC believe it adds value to the Tokens and increases Token sales, mainly because you only get 1 market slot without a token and you get 10 with one. If that’s not bad enough, you get a 30% tax on everything you sell without a token, making life even harder. Furthermore, IMC argues that RMT harms the economy, however I argue that you haven’t actually stopped RMT, or even hindered it. What you have done however is decrease the player population by harming retention with perversely overpowered restrictions. Players that use RMT can be banned, players that quit the game due to terrible restrictions can not be solved. A high population with a slightly weakened economy is a far worse outcome than a low population anyway, because as we’re seeing right now, a low population means a bad economy anyway. If you don’t have players, you don’t have an economy.

Not only this, but new players aren’t even able to use the market. A new character can not use the market until reaching Rank 2 AND being on an account over 1 week old. The problem with this, as we can see from the Steamspy info, is that new players don’t play the game that long before quitting. In fact, it takes just a few hours for the majority of players to quit. Why? Because they learn everything they need to know in those first few hours. A new player tries to sell their first items on the market and immediately becomes extremely annoyed by these restrictions.

In short, the above argument made by IMC in the blog post amounts to “Let’s ruin the game to stop others from ruining the game”.

A full list of the current market for f2p:

1 Market Slot
30% Tax
1 week old account
Rank 2

I think this should be changed to:

5 Market Slots
15% Tax
3 hours gameplay on character

5 market slots
One slot is useless. It stops players from participating in the game properly without a token. This is a restriction in place that seriously harms the game. 5 slots still gives a big benefit to token users, while also allowing players to actually participate in a part of the game that is standard and expected in every MMO.

15% Tax
30% for f2p players is way too high. It makes people reluctant to sell anything at all because they’re losing far more than they would if they had a token. This wasn’t too bad back when Tokens only cost 500k silver, but these days when they’re 3million+, it’s too high and results in far too much lost for f2p players to be expected to use. In combination with 1 slot, it just makes the market pointless. Token users still get a benefit of 5% over non-token users, which matters a lot when players get to later levels. It doesn’t matter at low-levels and that’s where the game is losing the majority of their players.

3 hours gameplay on character
You know what people say when they see one WEEK as a restriction? “Haha no”. And they quit. The length of time on the restriction is enormous and incredibly intimidating. 3 hours of gameplay is much less intimidating to read than ONE WEEK. Either way I still don’t think it matters at all. There is no difference in difficulty for a botter between no restriction on time and having a restriction. They make 5000 accounts and let them age 1 week before they use them, then they spend 20 minutes reaching Rank 2. It does nothing to harm them at all.

TL;DR:
Market restrictions are one of the top 3 complaints about the game in 99% of reviews and critiques.

They hurt the game. They even cause new players to quit as soon as they get to Klaipeda. The above is a list of suggestions for changes and explanations on why those suggestions are better than the current system.

The market restrictions tos has are a lot like bad DRM in games. They barely do anything to the pirates while hurting the legitimate players a huge amount.

I encourage others to politely discuss changes in the market they want to see. Please try to be constructive. And please try to remember that these changes should occur because we should be trying to increase the number of new players that choose to continue playing the game after their first day.

Here is a completely irrelevant gif of Kanna-chan to breakup my giant wall of text.

[Queue]

Why do the market restrictions exist? You say because of bots

This is a real core question. If the restrictions do actually help in reducing bots by a significant margin, then that would reflect on our answers. I think it actually probably helps for the Rank 2, level 40, and one week restrictions. It gives both IMC and Steam time to find the bot accounts and ban them. But that all depends on the efficacy as to if it’s worth it or not.

I’m pretty sure that people at IMC believe it adds value to the Tokens and increases Token sales

That’s certainly part of it. It’s enticing their premium service, the basis to their revenue model. If done correctly, the players can be content, and the company can make their revenue, but right now it is too restrictive and the balance is off.

5 Market Slots
15% Tax

These two are very reasonable. Bots can just make more accounts if they want to sell more, players cannot.[quote=“Awoooo, post:1, topic:358702”]
3 hours gameplay on character
[/quote]

Like I said earlier, this is the only one that has me unsure. It really does depend on how well their anti-bot system is working. If it doesn’t work well, then I’d have no problem with it, if it does then my position could change.

---

I also suggest a removal of all the F2P restrictions immediately upon using a Token. Right now even a player who’s using one has to wait for a week and be at level 40 to have full access to the market.

I’d further recommend the removal of restrictions on new characters within a verified account. This restriction even within IMC’s current plan makes no sense as I’ve already “proven” my account to be legitimate by their own criteria.

Another potential option that could prove particularly useful if some of these restrictions do actually help reduce botting, is “rewarding” players with more market slots. Token players would automatically have access to their additional ones, but maybe slots could be given out at certain level intervals, 1, 30, 60, 90, 120, or similar. This would be a reward instead of a punishment.

IMC also needs to make their current, and future restrictions much clearer. I’ve helped many players who were confused due to the lack of in game information. This is related to a larger problem though within TOS, as it lacks a good tutorial, and has no in game information guide to help make these things clear.

[Awoooo]

This is a real core question. If the restrictions do actually help in reducing bots by a significant margin, then that would reflect on our answers. I think it actually probably helps for the Rank 2, level 40, and one week restrictions. It gives both IMC and Steam time to find the bot accounts and ban them. But that all depends on the efficacy as to if it’s worth it or not.[/quote]

You can make 5000 accounts and ignore them for 1 week, bypassing the week restriction.

It takes me 2 hours to hit level 40 on a new char, playing relaxed. Probably less if I tried.

This is only hurting new players. It’s not affecting botters. It isn’t giving them any ability to spot them sooner because, like I said, they don’t actually have to be playing to get past the one week restriction.

Regardless of this. It doesn’t change the fact that the restriction is more damaging than the RMT.

Like I said earlier, this is the only one that has me unsure. It really does depend on how well their anti-bot system is working. If it doesn’t work well, then I’d have no problem with it, if it does then my position could change.

The logic behind this is that I expect a staff member at IMC to believe firmly that they must ignore the suggestions of the community because they-know-best. Someone internally will want the suggestions to be slightly different to what the community is asking for to show how important and smart they are at their job. I don’t think there should be a time restriction at all, but if there MUST be, then new players absolutely should not read a piece of text that says “wait ONE WEEK before you can use this game feature”. One week vs 3 hours is an order of magnitude difference in scariness.

I think 3 hours is pointless too, for the same reasons a one week old account is pointless. You can login and do nothing for 3 hours to circumvent it. But someone at IMC will insist on something stupid still existing.

I also suggest a removal of all the F2P restrictions immediately upon using a Token. Right now even a player who’s using one has to wait for a week and be at level 40 to have full access to the market.

I agree. It’s pointless.

I’d further recommend the removal of restrictions on new characters within a verified account. This restriction even within IMC’s current plan makes no sense as I’ve already “proven” my account to be legitimate by their own criteria.

If IMC have access to Steam accounts, I wonder how viable it would be to look at what other steam games are owned by the account. I’m willing to bet the bot accounts don’t own any other steam titles. Especially any games that cost money. If they checked whether steam accounts own other games then it could tell them whether there is a high-risk of an account being a botter.

They won’t do this because it’s effort that they can not use for all-regions. But I think it would be a powerful way to flag risky-accounts for moderation.

Another potential option that could prove particularly useful if some of these restrictions do actually help reduce botting, is “rewarding” players with more market slots. Token players would automatically have access to their additional ones, but maybe slots could be given out at certain level intervals, 1, 30, 60, 90, 120, or similar. This would be a reward instead of a punishment.

Sounds reasonable. However I think restrictions on total slots exist to stop the price of items crashing. By having time limits for length of time items can exist on the market you can stop too many items being placed on the market making the value reduce to meaningless amounts. I think the cap of 10 exists for this reason.

Similar exists in multiple pay to play MMOs, so it is likely that it has a separate purpose.

[quote]IMC also needs to make their current, and future restrictions much clearer. I’ve helped many players who were confused due to the lack of in game information. This is related to a larger problem though within TOS, as it lacks a good tutorial, and has no in game information guide to help make these things clear.

There is a lack of quests in the game that explain game mechanics. Most MMOs make you perform an action once as a quest in order to teach you a mechanic. Here is an anvil, upgrade your first item. Here is a Blessed Gem, make your first transcendence. This is the pvp arena, play your first match. Etc. ToS literally never teaches any of its features via questing other than the location of the shop NPCs in town.

I would like to invite IMC to re-read the old discussions about their restrictions from over a year ago, to see that people were trying to tell them the same thing we’re telling them now. And that the opinion has clearly not changed with time. If anything, the community has been proving correct in their old criticisms.

IMC's Official Stance Announcment on Trade Restriction • r/treeofsavior

[Queue]

You can make 5000 accounts and ignore them for 1 week, bypassing the week restriction.

The idea though is Steam would catch suspicious bulk accounts like this. But I’m really not sure what Steam’s up to, they tend to keep quiet.

It takes me 2 hours to hit level 40 on a new char, playing relaxed. Probably less if I tried.

Level 40 is probably pretty useless, but IMC is the one with the numbers.

This is only hurting new players. It’s not affecting botters. It isn’t giving them any ability to spot them sooner because, like I said, they don’t actually have to be playing to get past the one week restriction.

Regardless of this. It doesn’t change the fact that the restriction is more damaging than the RMT.

I agree, it’s definitely among the most popular complaints. My only hesitancy comes from the chance it’s helping them catch a lot of bots, in which case that number would matter, unlikely, but possible.

The logic behind this is that I expect a staff member at IMC to believe firmly that they must ignore the suggestions of the community because they-know-best.

That’s a very interesting point, which could unfortunately be true. We should really press IMC for information on it to force their hand into analysing their practises, or just encourage someone internally to do it.

If IMC have access to Steam accounts, I wonder how viable it would be to look at what other steam games are owned by the account. I’m willing to bet the bot accounts don’t own any other steam titles. Especially any games that cost money. If they checked whether steam accounts own other games then it could tell them whether there is a high-risk of an account being a botter.

They kinda technically can. Websites like SteamSpy track the numbers of how many accounts own how many games, and it can give a good indication of bots. TOS for example right now, has about 14% of accounts that only have 1 game in their inventory.

In reality though it’s not practical for IMC to be the one checking. It’s mostly Valve that would have to go through their processes to find them, and Valve has stepped up their bot hunting, especially since the CSGO drama. And while I’m not sure, it may be/have been the case that reporting bots in game, report the accounts to Steam as well.

Sounds reasonable. However I think restrictions on total slots exist to stop the price of items crashing. By having time limits for length of time items can exist on the market you can stop too many items being placed on the market making the value reduce to meaningless amounts. I think the cap of 10 exists for this reason.

You’re right about the market slots. It’s more about bypassing the restriction than increasing it though. So no change for Token users, only F2P ones.

There is a lack of quests in the game that explain game mechanics. Most MMOs make you perform an action once as a quest in order to teach you a mechanic. Here is an anvil, upgrade your first item. Here is a Blessed Gem, make your first transcendence. This is the pvp arena, play your first match. Etc. ToS literally never teaches any of its features via questing other than the location of the shop NPCs in town.

The current system is entirely inadequate. Mandatory quests could work, as could implementing more useful tooltips, an in game wiki like function, and other help buttons.

[Awoooo]

The current system is entirely inadequate. Mandatory quests could work, as could implementing more useful tooltips, an in game wiki like function, and other help buttons.

I really dislike anything that involves a lot of text. I don’t think it works to teach people.

I know it sounds counter-intuitive because they still have to read text written by normal-players teaching them the mechanics. But, the reason the quests work is because people actually do them.

We already have popups that appear throughout the game teaching a lot of these concepts. People aren’t reading them. They’re not a good teaching tool.

They should make a new set of tutorial quests with Purple colours and call everything purple a tutorial quest. But, that’s beside all the market issues really. I pretty much agree with everything in your last post aside from defending IMC on the restrictions IF it is causing bots to be banned. Even if it is causing bots to be banned, I don’t think it’s a good approach if it is causing players to quit. We know for a fact that it is causing players to quit as basically every complaint and review of the game ever made includes the market restrictions. They can and should find different methods to handle bots that are not causing such a huge negative to the players.

[Sayurichan]

If an anti-bot/anti-RMT feature, like market restrictions, exist to (according to the publisher) “combat bots and RMT” yet bots and RMT still exist and bots and RMTers don’t get punished/banned properly then that anti-bot/anti-RMT feature is utterly useless and just a burden and annoyance to the honest players.

Bots don’t care about market restrictions, they don’t care how long they have to wait or how big the market tax is, they’ll just wait or bot a bit more to get enough silver.

RMT-sellers don’t care about market tax, they just ask for a few $ more from their customers to offset the market cost or silverfarm-bot a bit more to get the required silver.

As a rule for good game design : When it comes to implementing anti-bot/anti-RMT restrictions that might annoy players, only do it if they are absolutely neccessary, working properly and actually fulfilling their purpose (aka actually stopping or at least hindering bots/RMTing).

And never implement something that pisses off players, like that 1 week restriction. Bots don’t care about waiting, how does that combat botting?
It would only help against botting if you’d actually ban botters. But most of the time you let botters run free for weeks/months, if you ban them at all.

[TheAlleyCats]

It gives both IMC and Steam time to find the bot accounts and ban them. But that all depends on the efficacy as to if it’s worth it or not.

The idea though is Steam would catch suspicious bulk accounts like this. But I’m really not sure what Steam’s up to, they tend to keep quiet.

Except, despite being advertised as VAC protected, it is not. Steam (valve) can do nothing since TOS doesn’t use VAC.
Also, you can check how much time it took to IMC to ban some (not even all) of the Schwarznagger’s bot army (months), with all the proofs provided.
At some point, they also said that it was a legitimate player.

These restrictions do not work, are useless and drive away new players.

[Queue]

A combination of quests and tooltips are by far the best methods. Forcefully going through the motions can help learn and tooltips are perfect as they tend to be short and at the very least point you in the right direction for what you need to know. If there’s something like a restriction on the market, all that has to happen is a quick dialog box that’s says “This is part of our anti-bot measures, you have xx amount of time.” etc etc.

The colour scheme is a good idea but purple is already taken so maybe yellow or another one could be a better option.

I pretty much agree with everything in your last post aside from defending IMC on the restrictions IF it is causing bots to be banned. Even if it is causing bots to be banned, I don’t think it’s a good approach if it is causing players to quit. We know for a fact that it is causing players to quit as basically every complaint and review of the game ever made includes the market restrictions. They can and should find different methods to handle bots that are not causing such a huge negative to the players.

That’s under the current restrictions. If the restrictions were lessened and only the most effective ones were maintained, then there would be less to complain about. And for me, it would have to be VERY effective to be worth it. I’m really barely “defending” just entertaining the possibility it’s more effective than we think. From what we’ve speculated I’m entirely in favour of a removal of restrictions.

Except, despite being advertised as VAC protected, it is not. Steam (valve) can do nothing since TOS doesn’t use VAC.

VAC isn’t what bans bots. It’s an anti-cheat specifically for modifying game files. The aim is Steam finding the bot accounts in Steam, not in TOS.

Also, you can check how much time it took to IMC to ban some (not even all) of the Schwarznagger’s bot army (months), with all the proofs provided.
At some point, they also said that it was a legitimate player.

That’s a slightly different problem. IMC doesn’t even view them as the same. The kind of bots that could get caught up by restrictions are normal silver-farmers, not a semi-sophisticated one like that. It is a good illustration of IMC’s failures combating the later game botting problem though.

[TheAlleyCats]

VAC isn’t what bans bots. It’s an anti-cheat specifically for modifying game files. The aim is Steam finding the bot accounts in Steam, not in TOS.

I know what VAC is, indeed if was enabled as advertised, we’d have way less problems now.
Besides, Steam allows to register any amount of accounts even to bypass VAC bans, so I don’t see why they would even bother to look if someone is a bot or not.

The kind of bots that could get caught up by restrictions are normal silver-farmers, not a semi-sophisticated one like that. It is a good illustration of IMC’s failures combating the later game botting problem though.

What I’m trying to say, is that IMC isn’t able to figure out if a player is botting or not even when provided with solid proofs.
And when they finally manage to ban them, they get unbanned after a week.

These restriction end off drivining away normal players that try to buy something in the market and get frustrated when they read they have to wait a week, token or not.

[Queue]

Besides, Steam allows to register any amount of accounts even to bypass VAC bans, so I don’t see why they would even bother to look if someone is a bot or not.

Steam does ban bot accounts so I’m not really sure where you’re headed, so given a week Steam may be able to catch some. That’s really all I’m suggesting and I’m not even fully convinced of it.

What I’m trying to say, is that IMC isn’t able to figure out if a player is botting or not even when provided with solid proofs.
And when they finally manage to ban them, they get unbanned after a week.

The restriction in place isn’t meant to deal with that. I’m not defending IMC because they obviously messed up, I’m saying it’s a bit of a different issue. Important, but different.

[63scaur]

1. Pay tax only when item is sold, not when listing.
2. Longer listing duration.
3. No waiting period for new accounts. Just remove it, doesn’t affect bots.

[Valkoria]

Listing taxes are actually quite important, It prevents players from endlessly undercutting others. Maybe the price could be tweaked but a tax should stay.

[TheAlleyCats]

Steam does ban bot accounts

The only bots that steam bans (that I’m aware of) are trading bots and spam bots, often it’s required to report them.
I don’t think that Steam will police game’s bots (there is already VAC that deals with them in VAC enabled games), that’s all I’m saying.

I’m saying it’s a bit of a different issue. Important, but different.

I know it’s a bit different, but what I meant along the lines is that if they can’t ban (and keep banned) botters when provided with proofs, imagine what happens when they don’t have user provided proofs and act on their own.

The restrictions in place are just a small patch in a huge sinkhole, they don’t stop “stupid” botters, let alone the “smartest” ones.

Do you remember the flood of archers bot after they put these restriction?

[Adeodatus]

Market restrictions should stay, but be lessened the longer one plays the game.
E.g. you start with one slot market space on the first week (change the waiting time from 1 week to 84 hours = half a week) and get 1 additional slot per every week you play until you have 3-5 free slots unlocked.

This would help fighting the intitial bot problems.

Another way to do this is by adding free market spaces via mainquest achievement: as bots usually do not do quests/can’t do them efficiently, it would be fine enough to give free slots via following the mainquest[i.e. clearing all mainquests along the way, not one specific, because that would be abuseable by botters] until like level 200 to unlock 2-4 additional market slots[e.g. every 50 levels of mainquest cleared = 1 additional free market slot]. This should also apply to Token users, making them have 5 extra slots from the start but having to work towards the other 4 slots.

Provided with Team Storage, people with Tokens can just have 3-4 characters and put items in Team Storage to achieve the 10+ market slots anyway, so more restrictions that way won’t really hurt the economy that badly and give more advantage to players who actively play their characters instead of having x bots on the same account for market flooding/farming/etc.

Doing the quests actually makes the players go for the lore and discover the world instead of just rushing through it&running instanced dungeons/Hunting Ground grinding to level up…

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About the selling taxes: I believe the tax when putting something into the auction house should stay, and instead of taxing sellings, the initial listing tax should rise. That would enable enough silver sinking as most items are not sold during their listing time, while selling items would not result in additional loss due to taxes.
This can help regulating the market and fight inflation as higher prices would result in higher listing fees with no guarantee that anyone would buy the stuff listed[and also makes RMT more easily visible].

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About Tokens on the market:

Tokens and premium items should be restricted from being buyable from the market for new players.

This is an easy way to RMT and allows botters to obtain Tokens with fresh accounts(i.e. one week old, level 40+) to negate the botting/RMT-restrictions.
Make the premium tab being unlocked after one to two months playing would ensure that players buy their first Token [maybe IMC can offer a one-time Token sale for 30-50% off for the first Token that is purchased via TP for an account; this may result in an increased number of Tokens sold] and don’t/can’t start RMTing/whaling right from the bat once the restriction on the market is over.

This is way more efficient than restricting everyone from using the market for a week and then opening the world of RMT because they have Tokens and TP as many as you want to see.

[Awoooo]

Market restrictions should stay, but be lessened the longer one plays the game.

I have to disagree.

99% of players quit in the first few hours of playing.

Making the game worse during the earliest and most important part of the game where you’re trying to get players hooked is counter intuitive.

Mechanics that make the game better but only if you put up with something everyone thinks shouldn’t exist are a horrendous way to go about getting new players to play and increasing the population.

It’s especially bad because players have read about criticisms for IMC before starting the game, then they get to the problem and they think “Oh. The criticisms were right”.

You can’t upset players before they’re hooked. They have no reason to put up with something they see as bad.

Make the premium tab being unlocked after one to two months playing would ensure that players buy their first Token [maybe IMC can offer a one-time Token sale for 30-50% off for the first Token that is purchased via TP for an account; this may result in an increased number of Tokens sold] and don’t/can’t start RMTing/whaling right from the bat once the restriction on the market is over.

I also disagree with this. It sounds like a great way to make f2p people not even bother trying the game because they know they won’t even be able to get a token until they’ve played TWO MONTHS. That’s even worse than the one week restriction.

We should not be encouraging IMC to add anything to the game that limits or hurts people that want to f2p. That’s just going to hurt retention even more. Encourage f2p players. Get them hooked. Eventually they will become paying players when they’ve played a long time and really love the game. Making it even harder to get long-time players is not a sensible approach. The concept relies on cashing in on players by practically forcing them to pay for their first token to even enjoy the game in the first 2 months. What’s going to go through a player’s mind when they see that? “Oh, they’re forcing players to buy a token in the first 2 months, well eff this company and their bad-practices, I’m going to play Overwatch instead.”

Can’t agree with creating that kind of thought in a player on their first visit to the market being a good thing. It’s not. And it’s the kind of thing people will talk about on discussion boards everywhere as a reason that nobody should bother playing the game.

An even easier way to put it is that players should not be expected to pay for features that they can’t even able to properly try first.

[xtrcontato]

Nothing else to say.

[TheAlleyCats]

99% of players quit in the first few hours of playing.
Making the game worse during the earliest and most important part of the game where you’re trying to get players hooked is counter intuitive.

Exactly this and it’s not a problem of f2p only.
I’ve read many ragequit or upset after they bought a token just to discover that it didn’t lift the level/first week restrictions.

That’s the worst welcome you can give into a game.

[SlyGoat]

10 market slots without a token, unlimited (or like 100) market slots with a token. I’m legitimately always at the market slot limit. Lots of items just don’t get sold on the market because people don’t want to waste their market slots.

Remove the “wait to retrieve your items/silver” for token users at least, ideally for everyone. It makes no sense that I have to stare at the retrieve tab for an extra 10 seconds every time I buy potions or something.

Restricting new accounts does not effect bots unless IMC is really on the ball with banning new bot accounts, which they clearly aren’t. Bots don’t care that they can’t trade in the first week, they just spend that entire first week farming silver. Hell we’ve all seen bots that are well over level 200 who have been farming for months. They also don’t care that they only have one market slot, since they usually aren’t going to be getting drops that are worth much in their low level farming, they mostly exist just to collect silver. That one slot is plenty for them to sell their occasional battle bracelet (and I’m still convinced bots are the primary source of battle bracelets). Therefore, I don’t believe there should be any unique restrictions placed on new accounts/characters.

[ophiuchu]

I Love Tree of Savior; I Am Leaving Tree of Savior

The trade restriction in TOS was designed to solve the bot and RMT problems. I do recognize that it might cause inconveniences towards the players as well. If, like you have said, the restrictions were not there due to the fact that the bots and RMT are inevitable and unavoidable, would that have improved the game overall? Unless we compare two situations side-by-side, I cannot say for certain. However, I would like you to understand that we have been working on reducing restrictions through continuous patches.

The "Pay-To-Win" Token Scandal

Greetings ladies and gentlemen, The reason for this post is because I'd love nothing more than to see this game succeed and get better over time. However, due to a few of my real life friends quitting the game, I think it's time for change. My friends, family and I come from a long line of MMORPG's, such as Ragnarok, EQ, WoW, Guild Wars and many more. We've run our own guilds, been officers in many others, etc. so we have lots of experience and are picky about the games we decide to devote …

First step is for them to seriously actually do something about the problematic token system itself. That is something they control and can easily fix not the bot and RMT problem. Second after that decide if they are going to actually dedicate time and resources towards combating everything which they didn’t properly demonstrate at launch. Last would be another personal apology for the bogus system that has hindered everyone only making IMC more rich in the process after kicking founders to the curb.

All the farming, silver sinks, and everything they implemented is literally because they can’t or won’t to take the time of day in being proactive about these problems. The economy has been royally screwed since day one and thankfully most people did quit because that more than likely allowed problems to be more isolated with who has tons of items and silver to track down. Final step is once you fix the silly token system, put in a proper trade system, just make sure people who abused the last system for years don’t go and ruin your new market.

[Seiran]

dedicate time and resources towards combating everything which they didn’t properly demonstrate at launch

There goes the over-exaggeration again, all games have bot problems and it isn’t really solvable from day to night. You don’t need to put emphasis on something that’s out of hand.

You don’t just put 1000 people working to check bots 24/7.

All the farming, silver sinks, and everything they implemented is literally because they can’t or won’t to take the time of day in being proactive about these problems.

Which problems? So easy to talk and don’t cite them, right? Where’s the constructive part of the post? Just blame and exaggerate as always?

The economy has been royally screwed since day one and thankfully most people did quit because that more than likely allowed problems to be more isolated with who has tons of items and silver to track down.

Since day one? Mind saying why? Seems you’re into false claims again.

Like I said in a lot of threads, kToS silver issue on Roxona maps showed that they actually handled exploits that had really turned to be serious and silver was removed and players banned.

Final step is once you fix the silly token system, put in a proper trade system, just make sure people who abused the last system for years don’t go and ruin your new market.

People who abused which system? The token system? How does one abuse the token system?

The trade system? How does one abuse the trade system that has more limitations than room to try to abuse?

There you go again on only blaming with false claims/exaggerations and don’t bring not even a single valid thing to put as example to what you’re talking about.

The game has issues, talk about them instead of talking about ones that doesn’t exists. This post have like, no value at all, aside from being a troll post that only points things that doesn’t exists or over-exaggerated ones.