Tree of Savior Forum

Important elements of a great game?

I just want to share and discuss my primitive framework about how to make a great game while playing mmo such as tree of savior, at the same time ragnarok, and maple story. this is just a basic skeleton…

basically there are four elements
1 leveling
2 character specialization
3 map and monster
4 gearing

tos leveling mechanism is simple and meaningless, due to three factors, the exp card system, no interaction or linkage between character specialization, maps and monsters, and finally, u can simply leveling to lvl 280 or lvl 330 indifferent of your class specialization, maps and monsters.

in other words, the leveling process isnt challenging and in form of exciting party and adventure~ it is simply moving forward…

they make it in a way, you can move forward or level up easily regardless of your class specialization, location, composition of the party, and ideas by using exp card system. so there is no creative interaction between the map, character specialization and the leveling process.

maybe because no penalty for death in term of exp losses or literally, you just can’t dead while grinding…
i think linear progression is okay … but atleast make it abit interesting…to attract players…

once you make it to the end game… u should start thinking of how to farm more silvers by using your credit card…end.

just my opinions and experience. thanks

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I will jump ahead of a staff member:

"Thank you for your valorous feedback on our game, we will forward your suggestion to our development team.

Please continue supporting us (specially by wasting your money in our game)."

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lol… i will do so~ u are way smarter than them ~

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Unfortunately, all of suggestions and feedback fall into deaf ears, or better, blind eyes.

feel like the game could be better or not…haiz

A good feature…

Something that [Resolved] the ongoing IMC’ing.

huehuehue

They made the card system and all this new event jazz because literally their code is so bad the server can’t handle spawning monsters properly. Then since they also can not balance the classes they made useless skills and spells or “balance” working ones into being useless if deemed over powered. IMC doesn’t like to work so that’s exactly what the game does too it doesn’t work either. Then they expect the people who do work and make money to give it to them because they are too lazy.

And then all they come out and say is “oh, we imagined that so and so class should be like blah blah something something” or “the system we thought would do so and so because blah blah” then don’t even try to make what they said a reality. It’s all just a steamy pile of crap sugar coated in gachas, resets, tomes, hats, and costumes.

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ahh…ic, i want to be rich but don’t want to put in efforts and just rely on past glory pattern~

we need more moe moe ~

is this a new bait? coz im taking it~

cool bro~ boring leveling is okayish compared to weekly event called “breaktainance”, aka “have you found the bugs yet?”

tos is not a ready product yet, we are all alpha tester for this game and we pay for it (sounds like kickstater)

its okay, if u like it, u can grow old with tos, i think 2020 tos will be a great game~

huehuehue

I definitely agree with you that the leveling feels pointless and boring, but it can be uh “challenging” if you’re leveling something like a linkchrono alone. well this was before pardoners existed so maybe I’m just speaking out of bias.

I feel like in this game, it’s too easy to “know” everything y’know because of how linear and boring the progression is. There’s literally no air of adventure and exploration, all of it is just a tedious grind. and at endgame, instead of crunching through a map mill, all you get is token trivial gameplay extensions by farming for the same items that everyone else has. “difficulty” lies in the 3829032 layers of low drop/spawn rate and dealing with the other issues that the game has.

Though I guess I’m being unfair, Earth Tower exists even though it’s exclusive to meta builds. But even with that, nearly every first wave player I know got turned off the game by now because of how unfun the midgame was. And every newbie I tried to party up with on alts and get some fun out of the game with just stopped playing after a few days. idk how much people try to defend it, if it’s offputting it just is. You can’t argue because most of the more reasonable people don’t talk, they just quit.

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I miss the good ol’ time when there’s impassable terrain where ranged classes like archers and mages can strafe their prey in safety.
Or those dedicated ‘land of the undead’ maps where healers can play and grind.(then again our heals in this game is a joke, it can kill anything)

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What about the pract 290 hidden quests? The gem comparisons? The stat builds? The meta builds? ET compositions? There sure was some adventuring and investigation for the first people to beat them. Not because there’s guides about things you should forget about all the work behind them

Still, I feel OP misses a huge point. This is an MMO, so if you’re looking for the important elements for a great MMO, you should add socializing, and this game is pretty harsh to socializing (of course, at least for farming, you could be a pyro-chrono-thauma and have an oracle/doppel friend but that’s just a bandaid)

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This game hates socializing. Channel wide DPK makes players hate each other on the same map, non-scaling loot in some instances (Crystal mine, 290 etc) makes players solo instead of partying, poor frame rates makes players avoid large crowds.

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yeah, i feel u , and feel the same also lol

ofc I value firsts. Even though we take a lot of info from ktos, people admire first clears and all the theorycrafting and testing. But that’s only taking account of 1%, maybe even less, of the players. That’s why there was so much debate over the inital founders system, but a game should emulate at least some bit of adventure and give intrigue to even people who joined the game late. Unless a game can update fast enough to keep up with what should be a healthy amount of new players (which is impossible, esp for an f2p), available content shouldn’t be tedious, boring, and almost entirely predictable, even to someone like me who basically only looked at a guide (excluding datamined drop lists) once and struck lucky with making a linkchrono during founders. Telling people “ohh you’re still in tutorial mode” doesn’t help make anything more exciting.

By “knowing”, i mean what to expect next, in the moment. What is there to expect for 280 levels? running daily saalus, daily missions, daily lower level dungeons, and uhhh putting points into a single stat + the complementary gem (which takes even more tedious farming)…dude man, idk about you, but it’s so boring I eventually stop playing the game for long periods of time without even realizing I quit.

It’d be incredibly cool if everyone put their all into being the top player, but if you expect every player, all from varying backgrounds and varying schedules, to expend enough time and energy to all that unfun grinding and unrewarding farming, it just doesn’t work out well. I like high caps, I like the idea that effort leads to pride in a a character. I like mmos where people look at geared and high level characters and think “whoa, cool, I’d like to be like that”. I like people so famous in a community, they’re recognized outside the game. But the process is so mind-numbingly boring, and ET excluded, generally skillless unless you count mdef stacking as skill. the world somehow manages to be unexciting even though it’s generally beautiful. I don’t mean to make the game completely casual, I mean to make the midgame portions of it not so awful, and the endgame content varied.

I guess you can argue that this is the nature of most mmos, but imo, tos does it worse. At first, I figured that the game was just newborn and short on content, and that it would morph over time to a richer experience. it didn’t, lmao.

also you’re definitely right, a huge component of an mmo is socializing and this game makes it easy to hate people, and pretty much has one of the most annoying communities I’ve seen. thing is, i guess devs don’t see much money in making better social aspects. i’ve requested a buddy chat, benefits for non-matchmaking parties, etc. since the beginning of time tbh and I havent even gotten so much as a response. Plus, the community likes to split themselves into two and argue to death every time something new happens, so I suppose they’re not too eager to change much.

tl;dr: unga bunga teachers always tell you to make your strongest paragraph first and last

4 Likes

who we are to criticize, we are no one. they are the genius haiz.
but again… i would still like to write down my thought about the game.

what do i mean by adventure anyway…
monster
comparing the lvl 100 to lvl 200++ monsters… the differences are that u need to take 3 hits to kill lvl 100 monsters and 5 hits to kill lvl 200 Monsters.

no team work is required for any maps… each map looks different but feel the same…regardless of the map level, star, monsters, and design…u dont really need to care about it anyway…
it is like simply adding the map in order to make the world bigger…

feel like a big empty world to me

class specialization… i dont know about u guys… but for me… i stay royal to the conventional design and ideology…
swordman, good at physical aspect
archer… long range…
magician … different type of special effects~ ice , fire, and etc…
cleric, buffing, healing and etc…
each class has their unique traits and specialization… different maps and monsters provide different creative challenges which require teamwork, and forming different composition of party and idea in order to grind and leveling… quests and npc gives the spice and vibe to the design of the map and location~
different type of map ~ dungeon, and field~ different flow of leveling and grinding…

nop… too much of a challenge to the creator… we just make cleric the god… and rest of the class… i dont know … BS? all dps shiit lol
add more map… we need more map and level cap… quantity more than quality … end

Having servers that work is a important element of a great game.

1 Like