Tree of Savior Forum

How to improve class circles

So for the most part you will feel bad about taking C2/C3 in a class. The exceptions are when the class has a super scaling attribute or skill offered in C2 like Swift Step’s. It’s pretty simple to see why in almost all cases it’s better to go to a new class than go for second circle.

Let’s talk about short term first. In the short term level 10 skills are roughly equivalent to level 5 skills of the next rank. This is bad. It’s pretty easy to understand why this is bad. You can either have 3 level 10 skills, or 3 level 5 skills that are equal to those level 10 skills + another 3 level 5 skills that are a bit worse but you have cooldowns and more variety to fit into more situations. Level 10 skills should be definitively more powerful than level 5 skills offered from the next rank (both new classes and the circle).

Because you’re forcing yourself to have less variety and less things to do between cooldowns your skills need to be stronger to compensate. But now let’s think about 2 ranks ahead. With the linear scaling unless your skill gets more hits from leveling up (See: muiltishot, fireball) a level 15 skill will be weaker than a level 5 skill two ranks above or a level 10 skill one rank above. This isn’t okay. The level 15 skills need to be stronger than those or they’re throwaways.

The result is that you don’t want to go c2/c3 because they don’t offer as many new skills (often only one or two), and those new skills are typically similar to the ones you already have.

Now let’s talk about long term: Damage skills typically become invalidated as you advance to higher classes. Ones with no cooldown are preferably left at rank 1 for minimal SP cost since the majority of their damage comes from your physical attack later on. Percent bonus skills are the true longterm goals here, and these are what really entice you into going C2. Multihit skills scale alright, but if they don’t gain hits from levels there’s no reason to keep going into the class and leveling them up.

So there’s two ways to make you want to go C2/C3 typically. 1. Lock percent scaling skills/buffs behind these. 2. Have skills that get more hits as they level up. Not all classes have these, nor should they. You can change the balance around to entice people into C2/C3 without either of these. Idea 1 usually feels bad because it’s often not until multiple ranks later that you’re feeling the benefit of this and until you do you feel extremely gimped. Idea 2 is alright, but it’s boring that every decent scaling skill is like this.

While I don’t expect a serious overhaul of the stats and changing skills to use varying ratios to make scaling feel much better even though I’d like it I do hope you’ll take note of this. I think this is very important.

I dont see this happening at all on the game(right now, at least) o.o. There are a lot of builds that take c3 of a class into consideration:
archer>ranger3>fletcher2(for now, probably 3 at rank7)
cleric>priest3>monk2(for now, probably 3 at rank 7)
Wiz3>ele3(whatever on rank 7)
Sword>high/pelt>barb3>fencer/doppel
cleric2>sadhu2>druid
I know a few archer variants use archer3, some people have taken cleric3.

I think archer’s a pretty special case because Ranger is the only direct attack focused class until rank 5, and swift step’s critical is locked behind circle 2. Wizard C3 is probably going to be very important when there’s 10 ranks, but right now is probably worse than just taking cryo or pyro and linker.

The rest of them it’s because you are severely disinterested in what the next class has to offer. For example you won’t go rodelero if you aren’t going to use a shield and cataphract if you aren’t going to use a spear. There’s no reason to grab skills you can’t use. Corsair C1 and Squire don’t really offer combat skills either. But come rank 6 if you aren’t going to use a rapier then you’d 100% pick up doppel if its skills weren’t bugged.

Someone aiming to be a monk really ought to take a level of Krivis somewhere.

cleric-priest-priest gives you 5 buffs to hit the buff limit. Krivis’s Daino is basically required past that point, since another level in anything will give you more self buffs.

Plus, Zalciai gives +150ish critical damage, and makes it much easier for you to critical.

Since the blessing auto attack build synergizes with dex so well, crits are exactly what you’re aiming for.

Priest c3 is practically the posterboy of ‘skills that don’t scale well with skill points’.

Well, you are still investing 2 ranks into priest. Something that according to the OP “would not happen”

Sacrament, Revive and Mass heal are three brand new 1 point wonder skills. If priest was a c1 max class, and there was some other class that had those three skills as a starting selection, I’d take this other class.

Compare cleric C2. Fade and divine might are terrible, and Heal, Deprotected Zone, and Safety Zone just don’t scale well.

Cure scales well, at +20% base damage per rank. none of the rest do.

Priest has the benefit of gaining 3 skills from circle 2, something most classes don’t have. 3 Skills that are all very good and worthy of rank 3. If every class gained 3 skills from a new circle instead of 1 then half the time it would be a decision between whether you wanted those new skills or the new skills of another class.

The problem is that most skills are not worth investing points into once you have the next rank, and going C2 and C3 in a class gives you no other choice most of the time.