Tree of Savior Forum

Excellence's Dueling Notes - Entry 1

General Discussion
#1

The following is a compendium of things I have noticed from Dueling/“early 1v1 PVP”. This is a listing of general information, combos, and glitches currently within the game. My notes will also be biased towards melee classes since I play one. Hope everyone can learn and enjoy.

Notes from duels and spectating duels between 28 October to 4 November, 2015:

-Priests are nigh unkillable in 1v1 due to their ability to heal as well as their direct ability to land multiple forms of magic damage on other targets. To dominate a priest would require 2+ stuns and 2+ knockdowns on alternate rotation with a very high crit rate and damaging skills. Their revive will make it difficult to truly kill them in duels and I suspect in “organized” PvP.

-Barbarians are the most common Swordsman classes but have major flaws: Most tend to go 2:1 Dex to Str or vice versa leaving them wide open to exploit their squishiness assuming you play a hybrid build with high enough Dex to match. They can’t block worth a damn. The primary rotation of Helm Chopper > Cleave X 2 is easily seen and avoidable. Seism is very similar to Cartar Stroke but it is an AoE stun and comes out very fast making it incredibly lethal in PvP - The only way to counter it is with a shield and high block rate, high dodge, or both.

-Swordsmen classes vary in PvP effectiveness. Anyone taking Swordsman C3 is wasting a class because they have no real attacks to justify hitting another person hard enough to do substantial damage. Double Slash from Swordsman C3 is ok…simply because it has good damage and a 3-point Overheat, but you could get Skyliner which hits just about the same and has synergy with Cross Cut.

-Stuns work through guard and dodge - Something I suspect wasn’t intended and needs to be fixed. For instance, if someone has Restrain but has crappy accuracy and you have like 400 dodge and high block, (this person being me, haha), they can still stun you for a second and a half.

-High CON is the only real way for any Swordsman to currently counter Mage class magic viably. It becomes a battle of combos and your damage vs their CC and damage. Likewise, Priests and Hunters have their own counters to Magic depending on stat distribution. Hunters can utilize their ranged DPS.

-Hunters/Archers are highly neglected it would seem in PvP but I expect their practicality will come into play in group PvP.

-A lot of people seem to not understand the concept of Armor Mastery. 6/10 individuals I’ve dueled don’t stack their armor and have their armor classes all over the place.

-Swordsmen need some form of a REAL CC breaker. Pain Barrier isn’t cutting it for anything but Knockdowns. A bolstering self-heal for Swordsman and Hunters wouldn’t hurt either.

-Jumping DOES have its usefulness in PvP…(mainly for annoying the crap out of you). Grounder attacks will not hit you…and example being Barbarian’s Cleave will not hit someone in the air. There should be a penalty for getting hit in mid-air though, similar to how it was in Tera Online.

The next few bullets will be related to Swordsman attacks and their PvP effectiveness.

-Bash needs to have a knockdown attribute to be fully effective…(Level 3 Bash at least), otherwise, you’re better off taking it off your skill bar.

-Knockdowns don’t work on individuals with Safety Zone or Pain Barrier. Don’t bother using or wasting your knockdown - That’s an easy CC even if it doesn’t hit that hard.

-Wagon Wheel is your friend but no one uses it for some reason. It does very high damage and is a “knockup”…(not a baby mama joke…), allowing you to hit people in mid-air or land another CC. It takes about 2 seconds for someone to recover from being hit by Wagon Wheel. You can also land Bash and Montano or Helm Chopper on them while they’re recovering to extend their CC recovery time.

-If you don’t have Restrain and someone else does, keep them at range for 40 seconds. They can stun you through your guard and your dodge.

-Hoplite can be lethal in PvP however, most of them go for defensive abilities and never maximize their offense. A good PvP Hoplite should use High Dex + Leather with a balanced Con and Str…(after both hit 50, pump Dex) setup. A good Hoplite will also take 2 or 3 ranks of Barbarian for the CC and added crit. The first person to do this over here in iCBT will dominate PvP.

-Cross Cut is one of the best attacks in the game as far as I’m concerned. Taken from the Circle 2 Highlander tree, it causes a bleed that does your normal damage but ignoring defense…for 10 seconds. It causes Skyliner to hit for double damage. It also has a LARGE hitbox. The hitbox extends out about 3-4 tiles in front and 2 tiles diagonally. The 2nd hit extends about 4 tiles horizontally in front of the player. It has a beautiful attack animation and a cool noise as well. Cross Cut is the reason that me as a Rodelero eat people up in duels. I simply land a Cross Cut after my CC chain and can block while they sit there and take Bleed damage for 10 seconds.

-You need at least 3 CCs to be effective as a Swordsman. Why? You need to be able to interrupt people’s rotations and break the monotony of up-front skill bashing. As a Rodelero who was previously Highlander and going Barb next, I have 2 Knockdowns with an overheat, 1 stun with an overheat, 2 pushbacks with a Darkness, and 1 shield slam that causes an interrupt and targets to turn around…(it actually works pretty well in PvP because people get confused and sht). This game is all about having a solid balance and making it work for you. Dealing flashy DPS may be nice but what does that do against a person like myself who can Block AND Dodge and also land long CC chains on you + a Dot?

-A few combos that really work:
Helm Chopper > Cleave > Cross Cut > Skyliner > Helm Chopper > Cleave > Seism. (Barbarian and Highlander)
Montano > Cross Cut > Skyliner > Montano > Skyliner > Shield Shoving > Moulinet (Rodelero and Highlander)
Block > Shield Shoving > Helm Chopper > Warcry > Cleave > Montano > Cleave > Targe Smash > Helm Chopper > Shield Push > Seism > Targe Smash > Seism > Targe Smash (Barbarian and Rodelero)

-You can block and dodge while being attacked by the Cataphract attack “Impaler”. It’s kind of funny but if you actually Block before someone uses it on you, they can’t toss you to the ground.

-Moulinet is nice but it’s hard to land. The hitbox isn’t as big as it would seem and you can’t move while the skill is going.

-Cartar Stroke is only good at the end of a CC chain and even then, maybe 4 charges. I wouldn’t recommend taking more than 5 levels of it - It takes too damn long to charge past that…even for PvE.

This is it for now. Hopefully this was an informative post as I plan on making many more to come. :smile:

-Excellence

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#2

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1 Like
#3

This is really excellent (no pun intended) :smiley:

I’m happy to see that hoplite can do well in PvP, I’m making one just for the love of it (I know barbarian is the favor of the masses)

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#4

They need to have a heal debuff or make Bleed reduce self-healing by a certain percentage.

#5

I feel hesitant requesting duels from anyone that takes more than one rank in in Swordsman. C2 is very questionable, while C3 is just a lost rank.

And I agree with how much people are neglecting CON in order to put more points into DEX, people are running around with so little HP it’s a bit hard to believe.

Just two things I really disagree on, though: anything that’s taken ranks in Highlander (including Barbarian) has access to Cross Guard, which, apart from being fun as hell to use, boosts your block rate by a ridiculous amount. Sure, you cannot attack through it, but it’s mostly a non-issue (unless they decided to stun you, I guess) since it’s a great way to ‘‘time out’’ other people’s buffs and dangerous moves.
Also, I don’t think a self-heal for Swordsmen is needed in the slightest. They already get a huge class HP modifier, and the consensus is that they don’t require any improvements. Definitely not this kind of improvement, at least. That’s what Cleric-type classes are there for in team PvP, agree?

#6

@Excellence
Were you Highlander c2 or 3 and how many circles in Rodelero did you take?

Peltasta... May or may not be good
#7

I had 2 characters, 1 was C3 Highlander and C2 Rodelero and the other was C3 Highlander, C1 Rodelero and C1 Barbarian.

Rodelero doesn’t shine till C2 and even then, it’s incredibly limited to PvP. That being said, you still get ridiculous synergy with Rodelero from Highlander and Barb because of the CC and active guard. C2 gives you a massive increase to Shield Push’s defense down which is NECESSARY, you have Shield Bash which jumbles up an opponent’s stats 1 step to the right which is just evil. It basically makes anyone who stacks Dex a target as it gets replaced with their Spirit stat. Slithering MAY SEEM USELESS and it is, but little known fact about Slithering is that it BLOCKS MAGIC. Just a bad translation and skill description.

Vertical Slash from Highlander C3 is your friend as a Rodelero because it does additional damage to opponents with debuffs…so all those CCs you add will now return merit.

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#8

@Excellence
What level were you?

#9

I really want to make a good PVP/PVE Fencer but it’s hard to work in multiple classes unless I go fencer at rank 7 :confused:
But I want to c2 it so… I’m going to miss my rank 8s

#10

and vice versa. I’m an avid duelist, and never have i lost to an archer class before --with my pyro-c2-link-sorc.

#11

It’d be cool if you can negate magic attacks/skills by casting skills on the projectile before it hits you lol

#12

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#13

It’s who gets to use their skills first wins imo. Both classes have CCs at first rank (Full Draw & Sleep) so whoever pull it off first gets the kill. Wizards have more CCs tho.

#14

Pryo, Link, Sorc can also kite with a ranged dps pet to boot.

#15

to curb you worries.
Cleric classes are the easiest to kill.

Atleast for some other classes, that specialize in it.
Any class that silences, hard cc or can remove buffs.

FLETCHER is an cleric and wiz killer …
Remove Shield.
Silence.
Bleed to make them unable to channel skills.

I had some 1vs 1 fun xD. Sadly silence wanst avaible to me then xD.
I removed they’re shield … and yeah. Found them in a wtf situation.
Without safety or reflect … they’re easy to get.

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#16

that is the case, only, theoretically :wink:

… for most of the time, i actually need not cast any of my pyro skills (except when i badly need to cc), as ur summons are more than nuff to seal the deal: lvl5 familiar, lvl1 salamion, leveled companion. The boss (summoning) i only reserve for dealing with “tanky” classes (e.g. clerics, swordies)

#17

agreed (from a mage’s perspective), so long as they skipped pardoner in their build -_-

1 Like
#18

Good~

You will fall pray to silence, bleed, remove shield.

xD

I would cast the summons instantly. Or better before the match…
Don’t take em lightly xD.
Specialy if your not waryying

#19

Being that Swordies don’t have a Silence or Magic Blocking effect, that makes a lot of Cleric classes a weakness for anyone who hasn’t stacked a few stuns and doesn’t know how to chain together knockdowns into DPS rotations.

As far as being “kited” by Ranged DPS, not in my experience. Being a Hybrid build between Very High DEX…(about 200) and 50 CON as well as 50 STR + Leather Armor, I had roughly the same, IF NOT MORE evasion and accuracy as any Archer. To add that, they can try to kite and I’ll just sit there and put up a block with my shield which won’t break, all the while the Archer is just chewing through SP…(which is VERY fast). Run up and start a CC combo into a Bleed and finish with a hard-hitting multi and it’s GG.

#20

I could care less about those, as it is, a sorc’s main dps are his summons, so my priority while dueling is to best take all the aggro, do some kiting and stay alive while my minions dish the free hits :wink: