How dare you delete your educational post.
The real difference is if you factor in time.
If player one has been farming the area for 13 hours while player two only 4 hours and random players show up every now and then.
The possibility that the person spending 13 hours farming that item will have it jacked by the 4 hour player or the random player is still very real.
Whereas a real RNG drop system the 13 hour farming player wonât have his drop jacked by another player.
From the perspective of someone whoâs invested a lot of time into farming an item, the real RNG system opposed to the lottery system gives a greater feeling of accomplishment for hard work.
So far a lot of evidence points towards dpk. Its not just this guys posts but others in the boater thread as well. On top if that when i started some people already had an idea that it was a dpk system. This isnât a new thing, weâre just finally seeing evidance of its exsistence. I also know how rng works, i still think that feels better then kill 100k enemys then do it again if someone steals the kill for you.
What kind of evidence? I still havenât read anything that would point into DPK over RNG system at all. âI killed 126k mobs and didnât get a dropâ is certainly not evidence for a DPK system.
As said low drop items are bad to test with. Find a map that is so unpopular that it never has another player on it, kill a mob with a 50% drop. If itâs a DPK system, then you get the drop exactly every second kill. If you sometimes get two items in row and sometimes no item two times, then itâs RNG.
1 Like
Well im not combing through the thread but several people in the boater thread compared drop orders and number of kills and noticed a pattern, it wasnât the boater it was based on weapon drops, blue orb, red orb and gem. Also i never said all items are dpk i think there is a mix of rng and dpk depending on the item. I agree more testing should be done but right now it looks like there is some sort of dpk system in place.
1 Like
You seem to be of the opinion that IMC would not go though the effort of making two systems, one being RNG based and the other being DPK based. The fact is that not only would this be simple to implement code wise, but it would also make for cleaner drop tables. Instead of having one huge drop table with manually input % drop chances, you have a smaller % drop table for âsmallâ things and a second drop table for rare drops that just contains the name of an item with a fixed integer.
Yeah I definitely donât believe they would do that and it also sounds more complicated to do and certainly not âcleanerâ.
To anyone feeling they may have missed out on something. Original post; verbatim (typos and all) for those interested.
Additionally I want to point out that I wasnât saying anything against OP on a personal level. Some testing is better than no testing. I was only pointing out that coming to the community and saying something is true because you tested it, but provide no documentation aside from recollection of the approximate steps you used, would not suffice and would likely be rejected. As seen in subsequent replies.
Thatâs not saying the testing was wasted on the community; a lot of people have since gained the desire to help collaborate and run their own tests. That in itself is a good thing. However it is undeniable that the oversight concerning the lack of documentation in regards to OPâs tests and findings was a set back some couldnât get over.
The next notable reply was as follows (again, verbatim):
@Bald_Dad Not everyone will always agree with something that is said. This is the nature of any online community and is no different here in TOS. Even if you are dissatisfied with the reception⌠your testing has still been a valuable contribution in some form or another. There is no need to delete posts.
4 Likes
Yeah people will disagree that gravity exists too. Thatâs why when someone disagrees with me and, after a few back and forths, they havenât convinced me to change my personal ideaâŚ
#their opinions:
3 Likes
I am also want to thank OP and support his discovery
I am working on collecting data and I will share my research in few days
Actually I tested this by killing 1 more of the monster that the OP claimed proved DPK.
And my findings actually disprove that DPK exists.
And my proof? Test it for yourself. /s
Isnât the Bot only killing 2-6 and the player is only killing 1-3 because the Random.Next method has an exclusive upper bound? ^o.o^
On another note, I have some gripes with the results. One is how the Bot can basically get more consecutive attempts at killing mobs if the sw roll happens to be from 0 to 1 (so the bot has a chance of getting 12 kills in a row before the player gets kills, which I feel can greatly skew the results). The other is the random player showing up to kill 10 in a row, not 0-2 between the attempts of the bot and the player. Since the order of kills matters for a test like this, having relatively large in-a-row gaps may skew the results.
Bots typically roll Cleric > Priest 3 > Chaplain and just auto attack mobs to kill them which is pretty fast, but I feel like actual farming builds would kill much faster than a Bot. Even if a bot was killing twice as fast as me, it doesnât mean the bot should be able to kill 12 units before I can kill the next one.
Donât get me wrong, I think the attempt to simulate the results is interesting and you were brave enough to share your code, but I donât think those results are a good gauge of the distribution of the item.
That doesnât mean I defend the system⌠far from it. I donât like shared DPK system either to be honest⌠but the code would have to be structured a bit differently to yield more effective results for the given scenario ^o.o^
To try to explain it further⌠I donât think the bot should ever be more than 3 enemies ahead of player in terms of how often kills happen between the player and the bot. I also donât think the player and bot will simply stop killing stuff just because a random person appears and kills 10 mobs.
Maybe it doesnât make as big of a difference as one would think, but the current test feels like it will yield some slightly skewed results.
I programmed it in 20 minutes for a ârough exampleâ to show the very real possibility of the person who spends 30 hours farming some high number drop rate only for a random person or a person who farmed at half the efficiency to win the item before he does.
I only really wanted to show that it can be anti-effort in this kind of way where you are working your ass off with a probability of someone getting the item before you do being a bit higher than one would think.
Can you look at the code and see the point I was trying to make? If you can then Iâve done what I intended to do with it. It would take hours for me to logic out a mock scenario more realistic to the bot vs. real player farm classes situation that you pointed out and itâs not worth my time just to make a quick point.
Thereâs no need to be defensive. I was just sharing my opinion ^o.o^
I wasnât being defensive. I didnât post this code on Stackeroverflow, I wrote it as a very quick example to make a point on this thread. If you want to fix the code up so itâs super accurate just to make a point to some random people on this thread itâs there for you to steal, opensource have at it lol.
I feel like my point was made with the code I did write. You are free to make it perfect to account for the factors that youâve stated if you are interested in seeing what will change about the numbers showing my example.
Post it up, weâd love to see it.
Iâve washed my hands of coding until I improve my drawing skills. I just couldnât help but be interested in this DPK topic because I never knew about it until the OP posted about it ^o.o^
Itâs funny cuz I always wished I could draw. Instead I can write creatively and write C# code but Iâd trade both immediately for the ability to draw good.
This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.
I still suck, I just suck less at drawing than I did 1 year ago when I started X3
You should definitely give it a shot if you really want to be good at it some day :3
Funny thing is I studied Graphic Design and during my entire course I had to turn in a full sketchpad of drawings every term as part of the course requirements and by graduation⌠I still sucked lol.
I was REALLY good at using software like Photoshop to achieve the results that I wanted but ultimately I wasted my money on that degree cuz it was just not for me.
But maybe if I was drawing because I wanted to get good at it rather than being forced to draw if it would make a difference.