Tree of Savior Forum

Does Double Weapon Assault is worth more than 1 point?

Class and Rank Swordsman
#1

I was super HYPED for this ability when I started doing my swordie but then I learned that it drains stamina like crazy >.> RIP the dream of machine gun AA melee dps ;_;

I originally wanted to go 5/5 DWA or even go for Corsair3 and end with 9/10 DWA for permanent effect but now I’m really demotivated :confused:

Is it even worth picking that ability? Or only 1 point is enough?

I planned to do something like this:
Corsair3


or Corsair2/Shinobi

but now after learning how DWA works I really consider putting only 1 point into DWA and rest into Jolly Roger


or just dropping it to max Jolly Roger


IMC devs if you read this please consider removing that stamina drain from Double Weapon Assault or change it into SP drain at least if you think DWA is Overpowered (I doubt that something in Swordman class is OP actually -_-). Bunch of classes have so much amazing selfbuffs that don’t have any gimmicks specially archer class while swordsman class is gimped everywhere.

  • Gun Ho reduce armor
  • Concentrate have limit of hits
  • Restrain reduce max HP and stun effect can be easily cured in PvP (scrolls, Plague Doctor, etc)
  • Cleave gives crit bonus ONLY for 5 seconds … come on guys… make it at least 20+ seconds
  • Warcry have long cooldown while effect lasts only 30 seconds
  • Double Weapon Assault costs stamina with every hit
  • Finestra reduce dodge
    and list goes on

Oh and btw Unlock Chest is the useless skill in whole game ;p WTB Cloaking skill for Corsair instead of Unlock Chest

#2

Aren’t there still +stamina boosts from hidden quests? I remember being able to get up to like 50 Stamina easily from hidden quests and maybe Plate Mastery 4 piece bonus?

I know that doesn’t fix the problem of Stamina drain, but it should give more room for using DWA ^o.o^

#3

50 stamina = 25 attacks only because each attack costs 2 stamina.

and then what? you can’t run/dash which is crucial for melee character (avoiding boss attacks for example)… specially in PvP

and now look at Q3 or Q3+A3. Running Shot or Running Shot + Kneeling Shot makes DWA and Corsair look like pathetic joke.

#4

double weapon assault not even worth more than 0 points
it’s pointless to up unless it gives dmg bonus or something
because the 2 nd connect hit use your secondary weapon 's damage which is always lower than your main weapon
so i have no idea what’s the point of using this skill tho

#5

Please allow me to butt in for a bit. @lukiner666 i would agree with you (but then again who am I to even matter) when you say Unlock Chest is useless because well… it is. As for the DWA matter, if you wear full Plate armor, which you should unless you are an Evasion type character (which I would avoid unless you’re a Fencer) in the current state of the game, you will easily end up with around 80 Stamina after a few hidden quests and gears such as Earth/Roxona’s Stamina Boost on boots. Even more if you decide to use some lower level armors which boost Stamina by 10 or so. Pair that with some Stamina Pills and it will start feeling less useless. You won’t be able to spam it for as long as you’d like but it will start being significant. Sorry for bothering.

Also, turn things around, rather than building a class path entirely out of one skill try and adjust that skill into your class path. That is, if you eventually take Corsair 3 then sure go ahead and 9/10 DWA at your own risk, just make sure to max Hexen Dropper because it is really decent and bursty. Corsair seems to be one of those pretty straightforwards classes if you’re building it for damage, since most skills are useless to max there (pistol shot, unlock chest, jolly roger (although sexy), kneel hauling, and to some extent Dust Devil). In the end (it doesn´t even matter~) you will not lose much by maxing your beloved DWA if you feel like it.

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#6

It allows you to attack much faster.

#7

If you are standstill, stamina naturally regenerates too. and with the cat buff from sorceror and the like, I’ve gone through rank 5 DWA and skill rotations without hitting close to 0 stamina, and been full when DWA came back up very shortly after. chronomancer buff works against you here though lol. Multiple hit buffs like sacrament love your double-attacking ability.

I see it as this, with proper watching of stamina, DWA is our filler skill - like fencer’s 0 cd skill spam. But this takes 1 use of sp and rest stamina, and it scales with added lines of auto attack damage. When all cds are used, DWA is much better than things like thrust and of course auto attacks alone, so I like having DWA at a long duration.

#8

yes and I always have my personallslave sorcerer in “companions” tab so he can always give me cat buff

oh

wait

no

dude no skill should require OTHER CLASS to be actually USEFUL…

Corsair is class that’s promoted as class specialized with dual wielding but in the end the main dual wield skill is garbage.

Sure maybe DWA may be good filler (I even heard people saying that actually every other skills are fillers for corsair while DWA is main damage tool) but it shouldn’t DRAIN STAMINA and then when it’s over leave you moving like slug because you have 0 stamina to run/sprint specially in PvP or in boss fights where you have to avoid AoE whole time WHILE Quarrel Shooter can become living machine gun and still be mobile 24/7

#9

i consider corsair to be a broke class atm.

hook -> long stride combo doesn’t work
DWA drains stamina
pistol shot weak
DWA doesn’t work with pistol
keel hauling overwrites stun from hook
long stride not working with dagger offhand

but…hexen dropper strong. and jolly roger nice party buff. and hook nice pvp utility even despite all the aforementioned.

I really wanted to like corsair c3, but alas, broken class is broken class.the actual worst part is that the stamina drain part is not in the skill description at all!

#10

it doesnt require sorceror buff, sorceror buff just allows you to spam it more. stamina use is just like other classes 0cd skill spam for us. if you do it nonstop, you will run out. But I’ve had no issues so far on daily stuff with DWA spam at my 52 stamina (roxona boots prior to hitting corsair 2, lvl 15 plate mastery)

btw, shinobi bunshin uses stamina too. its not a big deal imo, management is just like it is for sp, if you need to do something with it soon (run during boss fight) then save some. at 44 seconds duration lvl 5 DWA, and around 10 second cd, with the few buffs to pop, and all the barb skills and dust devil and hexen, you will maybe use 20-25 sec of DWA. Figuring in base stam regen, that’ll put you like 30ish stamina below your max (just a guess, not testing). and you can even use stamina pills in an emergency.

but anyways, any time during a fight you would be using a 0 cd skill or autoing, and have any buffs that affect autos up. DWA is good. that and it stacks frenzy faster as a plus, which is one of the main things i use it for. DWA is a whole lot better than 5 wasted skill points. It is just not a game changing skill, which is what the entire swordsman tree needs more of to become more balanced – game changing skills.

#11

I like DWA. Honestly it all comes down to management. Use skills? Watch your mana and carry SP pots. Use sprint and DWA? Watch your stamina and carry stamina pills. You really shouldn’t have much down time in the DPS department if you’re watching these two things as you should be. Venom Dagger also really makes DWA shine when it goes off.

Regarding pistols not working with it, well… I wouldn’t mind seeing a pistol whip skill myself but that’s what ALT+Z is for. Hook works great for not only 3-way capturing (allowing your team mates to go crazy) but if you do single target and cast keel hauling (admittedly Keel Haul as a stand alone skill has crap damage) you cause bleeding. Stun again if you’re a Barb and have stun skills, further immobilization… Jolly Roger’s utility I shouldn’t have to explain. Hexen Dropper is just gorgeous, especially paired with anything that increases pierce damage.

The only things I agree suck are Unlock Chest, it’s a hella crappy skill that is only worth it if you have keys and are planning to reset your skills. Pistol Shot I’d like to see be a little stronger, and it’s pretty much the only reason to go C3 right now, so it’s gimped. Most classes have some pretty lack luster skills though along with great ones, so it wouldn’t be that unusual if it wasn’t for Pistol Shot being the reason you go C3.

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#12

add to this:

  • monsters (and probably players) sometimes can move/run away during dust devil spining animation… isn’t it suppose to be some kind of root/crowd control? just freaking change it into stun (just like in Sonic Blow works in Ragnarok Online)… this way it will have even synergy with Barbarian’s Cleave
  • Dust Devil feels super weak
  • Dust Devil and Hexen Dropper have no special attributes despite they are the main damage skills of Corsair
  • DWA have no attributes at all…
  • Unlock Chest is a useless crap skill that should be removed and something else put in its place.
  • Iron Hook and Iron Hook + Keel Hauling are useless for 1 vs 1 since you can’t attack targets that are hooked. The only way to actually attack someone hooked is to use pistol and spam C button/use Pistol Shot skill… “Woah dude that’s totally worth getting C3 Corsair /s”
  • We have no info about drop rate of silver and items from Jolly Roger skill description.
  • Jolly Roger buffs very often spam/overfill buff UI so you end with 10+ buff icons with 0 second time left
  • Jolly Roger “pillaging” buff sometimes disappear for no reason
  • Dust Devil have bugged or just very small hitbox and it likes to miss. Multiple time when I was fighting bosses I wasn’t able to hit them with Dust Devil despite standing next to them… while Berserk/Swordman skills always hit them

my suggestion for Iron Hook interaction

A) When using any Dust Devil or Hexen Dropper, Corsair dash to chained/stunned target and then use skill on it.
B) When using Keel Hauling target is pulled to Corsair to melee range like it’s now BUT it’s still stunned for 2-3 seconds so Corsair can actually use melee skill on it

my suggestion for new skill in place of Unlock Chest:

A) cloaking. Yes the same ability like Scout have. And don’t come up with “but Pirates don’t should be able to become invisible!”… ye same goes for Archers(Scout) duh! TBH the only classes that should have something like invisibility are Ninjas and Assassins/Thiefs and since we don’t have the second ones in ToS then Corsair class is the closest to resemble Assassin/Thief type in ToS: stealing items with Jolly Roger, class attribute for backstabbing with dagger, 2 skills that use two weapons same time (Dust Devil and Hexen), ability to use 2 weapons same time for auto attackings (DWA)… even if it’s crappy atm. Using hooks to catch enemies and pull them closer to Corsair to meet their doom

Example of what attributes cloaking could have beside the obvious “you move faster during cloaking”

  • Armor Strip - “after attacking something during cloaking you have 60/70/80/90/100% chance to strip armor (1~4 parts, DEX increase chance of stripping more parts) and place debuff “you can’t equip gear for next 10 seconds.” You can’t use this attribute together with Weapon Strip”
  • Weapon Strip - “after attacking something during cloaking you have 60/70/80/90/100% chance to strip weapon and place debuff “you can’t equip any weapon for next 10 seconds”. You can’t use this attribute together with Armor Strip”
  • Poison Covered Blade - “next attack after coming out of cloaking puts deadly poison (or bleeding) on target. Damage scales with STR or STR+DEX”
  • Steal - “for 10 seconds after you leave cloaking your auto attacks and skills have increased chance to steal items from monsters. Stacks with Jolly Roger.” OR “your next attack will have a chance to steal item from monster. Chance of obtaining rarer items scale with DEX”
  • Snare - “Your next attack snares target for 4 seconds.”
#13

I disagree with some of what you said (see my above post) but I agree there is plenty that bugs right now that needs to be corrected. I’ve been trying with a few other Corsairs on the forums to bring attention to this in order for them to fix the issues.

I’ve never seen Dust Devil bug and I have only level 5 with 0 attributes at the moment. It honestly does good damage and immobilizes targets, so I have 0 complaints there.

I do agree with you on a cloaking skill. Unlock Chest has got to be one of the most useless skills in the entire game, and since Corsair is our Thief class on this MMO, it would make sense. Some of those attributes would work too. I love the armor/weapon strip, usually Assassin’s in MMO’s have this ability, poison too. However since we already have a steal and snare skill that would be a little over board, still not bad ideas though.

#14

I’ve found the opposite to be true of DDevil for myself, being 3 hits is okay better than the plenty 1 hit skills without damage modifiers found in lower ranks, but the main thing i like is my hitbox. at my AoE attack ratio it hits lots of targets, but the first 2 hits seem to hit all around me, not just in front. this has been a very useful hit box while farming/grinding especially since large packs like to run behind me where any other attack i’d have to reposition and thus take damage while doing so. the cc has its uses too. between DDevil and my barb stuns, I’ve had plenty of easy times.

#15

the DPS from normal attack + DWA is very high, dont underestimate that skill… it does require a revamp though as well as unlock chest… i do agree its currently useless it should open boxes without the use of key, instead of how it currently works

#16

There’s an even better/simpler alternative to Unlock Chest.

Why not just simply generate chests in dungeons, missions, raids, castles and such? Keys could be a tradable items in the market and would drop from bosses.

This would automatically make Corsairs the kings of booty…

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#17

I have level 5 DWA and it has been worth it for me instead of level 10 DD. Like people have mentioned, it’s not a game changing skill like the counterparts in iRO so going C3 with level 9/10 DWA as a main feature will bring some huge disappointment. As a filler skill though it’s great, much better than auto attacks. The 8 second downtime at level 5 is not noticeable as you’ll be using that time for skills and buffs and on the odd occasion you will just auto for a couple seconds so I wouldn’t recommend going any higher if you’re set on C3.

As for the stamina drain, I have absolutely no issues. Currently have 64 stamina from max plate mastery, Roxona plate boots, and 1 or 2 from collection. When questing it’s my main skill except for mobs with 50K HP or more. I sprint nonstop and rarely get to 0 because there are plenty of crystals. When there are no crystals around like during missions and dungeons, just pop stamina pill around half way mark to manage CD for pill and it’ll be ready again by the time you’re finished your skill rotation etc.

I’ve timed it compared to auto attacks and the difference is roughly 2-3X killing speed with DWA depending on how fast your fingers are. Still it would be nice to see some sort of meaningful attribute or buff so that it’ll become the main attraction that it deserves, which I’m guessing the devs intended when designing this class.

p.s. buy the cheap 80s pills from Klaipeda/Orsha. Carry like 100+ with you. The big ones from Fedimian are not worth it, costing almost 5x more for only 10 more stamina and having a longer CD.

#18

sword will have more damage than dagger, so its roughly 80% more damage assuming delay cancellation doesnt affect attack speed. but i have noticed today thanks to another persons comment in game that holding dagger auto attack down and spamming MH auto button won’t drop an auto attack from one of them every so often if your ping isnt always low or have any fps lag.

even with DWA up, i stop autoing to use my skills as they come up, so there is about 5 sec or so usually that i have 0 skills worth using up and DWA is down. but, with enough buffs like sacrament, enchant fire, last rites. DWA makes your auto attacks stronger than even some skills.

186 pelt/barb2/cors2 atm, going doppel 1, build is aimed at r8 class or doppel 2 if r8 is bad (hope to god its not, we need strong ones to bring the class to balance with other classes) one thing ppl dont mention often is just how strong jolly roger attribute is. 12.5% chance to negate enemy attack is insane for tanking and dpsing through mechanics. at jolly roger lvl 10, not only does it give good pillaging and potentially decent atk power buff, but you can manage CD to have an entire room with the buff.

#19

Why you think it’s 12.5% on JR?
In other thread I saw something like 7.5%. Description says 0.5% per attribute which is max at 5. So 2.5% + what? 5 buddies in party? sounds more like 7.5% than those 12.5% you mention.
Very interested in finding out the mechanics.
Also, about dust devil. Does the cc of it increas with skill level? (I mean, the rotation of mobs).

@ topic: DWA is great. I use lvl1 though. Have some free points. maybe I will bring it to DWA 3 or I will invest them in dust devil.

#20

Dude the people in this forum simply cannot comprehend what both of us are yearning for I can see that we both have the same way of how we wanted DWA to be buffed as it is the main attraction of corsairs they see they talk about crap skill rotations , stamina pills etc tbh these guys just merely think were plain stupid to not think of those before posting here rofl, they dont even know we work our sht so hard while archers,qs3 spam their autoattacks like hell even gaining range,damage bonus and mobility lmao.

To other corsairs try playing your corsair and a qs3 go get a sacrament and blessing buff for both then tell me how cute your corsair is

btw I’ve already tried what I have stated above because I have both classes with my qs3 just using a grandcross xbow without a single upgrade while my corsair uses +5 trinity sword and +7 karacha dagger ah btw I play with 0.5-0.8 ping just saying.

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