Tree of Savior Forum

Can you please drop this concept already?

Veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery long sigh…

This &*&$ on a patch notes.

Seriously.
This trading restriction is just… I have no non-offensive words to describe it.

This is exactly what I mean when I say the effort is going to the wrong places.
I could say that these restrictions would be the death of you. But that would be a prediction. Something that will happen in the future.

As we all know, that already happened so y’all clearly didn’t learn from it. :expressionless:
This will still be the first game I play (That allows trading) where I’m only able to trade items with other players once and said item becomes untradable.

“But… but… but… the BOTs!!!111!!!” you might be thinking or saying.

Welp, they surely made it work regardless anyways. At this point the only people you hurt with these restrictions are legit players.

Sigh… I don’t even know why I bother with this game.
I think I need to drop this also and just play it while it’s available. With each day I feel the Tricksters vibe getting closer and closer. Those who played Vanilla Tricksters back in the day know what I’m talking about.

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They really want you to buy tokens and invest in keeping the game running. Shame on them! They should work out of cardboard boxes and remove tokens.

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Oh please.

What a lazy argument.
There are plenty other ways to gain money. Restricting trading isn’t one of them.

This was funny though. Nice try.

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Last week I managed to find someone to exchange my Female snowflake costume for a male one, to then realise the player in question did not have a token active, my reaction was ‘welp, I don’t want to turn my costume untradeable’, and so we both took our way.

Meh, this is quite hard to judge. Free to play games do require ways of income in order to have a way of investing for the game’s future. Honestly the trading limitations are one of the three last useful features a token provides, as some of them have already turned into F2P features and taking yet one more out will efficiently kill the use of it.

Until IMC finds a way for players to spend on their game where its income could potentially drop the token idea…It will remain as it is. Sounds like an impossible dream lol.

What a lazy argument.

Meanwhile you don’t actually have an argument. Look back at your OP. It is just ranting and raving.

I have token and i got HL3 costume untradeable. Already month i’m waiting to support move costume to char who needs that costume…
Stupid thing is i can’t even put it in TEAM F@#$ Storage. :tired:

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This is certainly something that should be revised. Leaving at least as team storageable after it turning untradeable.

I don’t recall your story, but one of the players had an event token instead, no? :thinking:

If ur message was addressed to me - nope.

Either you or the player you traded the costume with.

in the past, someone requested Staff to shift his item for him ( Mistake due to no token ) , and they did so

Oh the smartypants wants to read, fine.

You know why my post is not a gigantic text explaining why the trading restrictions are bad for the game? Because I already talked about these restrictions a million times before years ago in this same forum. You should know because technically you were here. Dismissing a post by the way it’s worded rather than by the content and subject behind the complaint IS lazy.

And that’s exactly what you did. In other words. If you didn’t had anything useful or if you had any disagreements you could have said it without the “trolly woobly imma be funny diddly doo” attitude.

To the matter of properly wording my problem concerning the trading restrictions at hand so that people like @Remiri here can read it and understand it.

Trade restrictions are an imposed benefit instead of an actual benefit to the player. They do not represent the reason why people buy Tokens in general although they are a part of the reason.
They are a part of the reason because they were imposed by IMC to work that way to try and force the player’s hand towards purchasing the Token.

This is an ill intended marketing tactic as it’ll subtract from the Player’s experience if said player doesn’t have a Token so that instead of buying the Token to expand his player experience they’ll buy the Token to be able to complete a mediocre player experience.

The same business model is being applied to costumes for instance. Back in the day we were able to purchase the costume we wanted directly through the shop. There were seasonal costumes that would be sold for a period of time. But if you payed for a costume you would get a costume!

After a while they changed it to the Goddess Blessed cube and removed almost 90% of the costumes available in the cash shop. I was one of the people that used to purchase stuff when it was on the store and stopped when it became a gamble.

Allowing them to exploit every crank and cranny of this game for pennies is what ruins it for people. Instead of working hard towards making the game enjoyable without cash so that people expand or buy cash because they love the game and want to invest on it, all they do is add more palliative solutions to keep their heads out of the water to be able to collect a bit more money.

The biggest issue with trading restrictions is the fact that when a person buys a token. It’s not guaranteed that he or she will be able to fully enjoy said trade advantages because their system requires both parties to have an active Token.

This is something that might work in theory but not in the actual game’s live environment.
The majority of the players in the game are Free to Players. This ruins both the first impressions of a new player that can’t trade stuff around with his friends because he is immediately bombarded by the necessity of keeping track of the items you’ll make untradable.
Or maybe this player invited someone else to join the game and he wants to lend some equipment to said player. Welp he can’t cause it’ll become untradable.

In conclusion this is one of the factors that contributes towards the inability of the game to retain it’s new players.
I can guarantee that if they revealed their retention/acquisition metrics we would laugh.

The player that wants to enjoy the game before investing significant amounts of money in it is constantly reminded that if you don’t invest money you are playing a half of a half-game.

The Token has a lot of appeal without the trading stuff.
Now you want more ways of making money without actually being dickheads about it?

  • Sell character slot expansions and allow players to sell those on the market as it used to be done in Granado Espada. o7
  • Add cosmetics and costumes and stuff back to the store and do seasonal sales renewing the catalog every now and then, thus creating the sense of exclusiveness for people that purchased the items when they were in the store, all tradable in the market, from Hairstyles to lenses and costumes.
  • Leave the gacha with the other items like the abrasives and headgears maybe.

That’s a start imo.

Have fun. Again. WHY AM I STILL HERE?! >_>

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These are exactly reasons why games like in Path of Exile people are willing to spend hundreds of dollars on over priced (in my opinion at least) costumes, because the company cares about their product and they don’t impose ‘features’ that restrict or ruin your game experience (except maybe having to buy one premium tab for like 3$ if you want to use poe.trade api if you want to nitpick).

The problem comes down to just the fact that IMC is willing to take a quick cheap dollar over several long term dollars. I can’t say which is better on a business perspective with a game like this because maybe IMC thinks this game was/is going to die after a couple years anyways, so they’re trying to find cheap tactics to maximize profits.

Who knows, none of us work for IMC.

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Trade restrictions have been in place since day 1. Fortunately, the restrictions have become significantly reduced since that time. It’s not ideal, but much better than it used to be. If it is such a big deal in your opinion, why would you still be here nearly 2 years later?

Honestly, the main reason the trade restriction is in place, which you have ignored entirely, is to funnel people into using the market as an exchange, which is a very important silver sink (10%/30% tax).

Surely an experienced gamer such as yourself understands the importance of silver sinks.

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I haven’t ignored it. I merely think it’s OK for them to restrict Silver trading to allow people to use the market. I fully understand the idea behind it and that’s not something I take issue with hence why I didn’t talk about it.

Also

You know that the game already possesses the greatest silver sink of all:
Attribute point purchasing. lol

But yeah, I can see why one would misunderstand my post.

Yeah but if trading was unrestricted, a lot more people would shift to shard/talt trading and the sink would lose its effectiveness.

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Oh my dear forum friendo. People already have.

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Point-for-point without needless quoting incoming:

  • Logically, anything that is added by the token is subtracted from the player experience if you don’t have it. You can’t make this argument for trades unless you are willing to extend it to all of the other features that the token provides. I could make the same argument about the movement speed that tokens provide and say that is an ill-intended marketing tactic, but I don’t think it is and neither is trades.

  • Restricting trades from tokens is not the same business model as Gacha. One is a clear benefit from using the item, which is explained, and the other is a random chance to get an item and most of the time you won’t get what you want, which is much more toxic. Feeding on peoples gambling addictions is fundamentally different than buying a token, so I am not sure why or how you are drawing that conclusion other than attempting to build Trump’s wall o’ text.

  • The base game should hold up without token use, or gacha use, and surprisingly it does. If you can tolerate the movement speed decrease (I can’t), then the rest is just convenience. Trading is still possible, and as long as both parties are aware of what will happen when the trade is done, it is fine.

  • I agree with this. A token user should be able to trade with a non-token user with no penalties, whereas the non-token user will have their items locked on that character.

  • Lending equipment isn’t really needed in a game where you can get pardoner buffs and explode through the content while naked.

Sell character slot expansions and allow players to sell those on the market as it used to be done in Granado Espada. o7

I like this!

Add cosmetics and costumes and stuff back to the store and do seasonal sales renewing the catalog every now and then, thus creating the sense of exclusiveness for people that purchased the items when they were in the store, all tradable in the market, from Hairstyles to lenses and costumes.

Yes, they should do this.

Leave the gacha with the other items like the abrasives and headgears maybe.

Leave gacha for Leticias but do something about Diamond Anvils.

I CAN DEAL WITH IT.

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yeah obviously, but it’s restricted. If you want say 150 trash cards you’re not gonna be able to get it done with talt/shards alone.

Awesome.

Now we’re getting somewhere.

I disagree with you in your first point counter-argument there.
I think an expansion (Which was the word I used) on the gameplay is different by definition than the lock of features behind paywalls, so-to-speak.

ex·pan·sion
ikˈspanSHən/Submit
noun
the action of becoming larger or more extensive.
“the rapid expansion of suburban Washington”

So by this definition, I’m considering benefits free to players already have access to but in a smaller scale (less beneficial scale) such as:

  • Experience Bonuses;
  • Instant Learning of Attributes;
  • Instant Access to Silver retrieval on the Market;
  • Less Taxation on the Market;
  • Ability to register more items for sale on the Market;
  • More Silver earnings from Defeated Monsters;

Possible additional ones:

  • More slots in the Team Storage (If free to players ever get access to a free version of the Team Storage);
  • Ability to remove cards without losing Stars at will;
  • Ability to have more than one shop open at any given time;
  • Ability to remove Monster Gems from equipment without breaking them;
  • Ability to change classes without doing quests;
  • Able to do a simpler version of the Hidden Class Quests (Maybe?);
  • Cheaper upgrading costs!?~

To sum up. I strongly believe that there are better more engaging alternatives to the Token’s benefits that don’t involve straight up locking a feature behind it. ^^

And I’m glad you and I had the chance to discuss in a civilized manner.

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Want trading restrictions working ok? then turn the market into something like BDO, oh wait, that’s too much for IMC? then ■■■■■■■ free the market and stop making people get tired of it

The taxes are stupid
The Limitations of items/retrieving in market are stupid
And the low price limits on RARE drops for non-token users is absurd
Limited transactions for token users and no way to trade with silver, that’s pathetic…

What other F2P game is as restrictive as ToS? stop being a dumb white knight defending this shitty system

And that’s just about

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