Tree of Savior Forum

Bosses and Knockdowns?

this video is good … hope IMC can learn from this …where one of the good ai is where it enable player to predict the a.i … they should put more casting bar and skill circle to the bosses with this player can predict and choose a good course of action… unpredictable situation is one of the bad ai design based on this video

OK Let me put it in a way everyone will get it…

Is not the space, is the time…

All this things don’t become a problem until the are spammed…

Sure boss X has 100B HP rug it off it happens you move on…

but if 10 bosses in a row has 100B HP you will hate it…

Boss Y uses Knock-back one or twice in 2 min and you stand up and deal with it…

But if boss spams knockback every 10 seconds you are fucking piss of your mind…

Boss goes invulnerable for 5 seconds and you wait it out…

But if the fuc<c<ker goes invulnerable constantly for 2 mins NOW that’s a problem

You fell on your own pitfall and too bloody soon it was :smirk:

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well that 2 different matter boss knockdown and invulnerable … well im a human too pls allow me to rant too :sad:

Only because you wish them to be :wink:

I play since beta too, but I have totally different experience than yours. The game was never ever have any challenge even when R8 first came out. And all IMC did to “Answer” player’s request was only tweak some configuration here and there. “Oh, you want difficulty, here, I can just add knockback to all his skill/AA and call it a day.” Instead of adding new behaviors to boss, all they ever do was just turn on some flag of the code. It’s like slap you in the face and say, take it and you still feel happy about it and defend them.

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I’ve never done guild raid bosses (don’t have a guild) and I can’t speak for those bosses but don’t you dare tell me dungeon 330’s boss doesn’t have any cues before he uses a skill that will knock you back.

There is that backswing into thrust, the one where he leaps onto you and the most random one, the one where he disappears and slams all around. Other than the last one, the first two cues are obvious as daylight and are entirely dodgeable if you jump. All knock back can be negated can be negated if you just jump at the right time.

Knockdown-hell was already a thing once and nobody liked it…so it is interesting it returned… I don’t play too much now but I would definitely hate it…

This is not entirely true if it’s not adjusted correctly. In one of the betas I reached crystal mines and the first boss there as a simple cleric and it was much more challangeing. It is a huge difference that even when I without the team exp I reached the place as a Priest already… The progression in the game is totally messed up and was much better once.

They didn’t adjust the difficulty according to the progression changes… and with pardoners… it just became worse.

I don’t know how others did it but I had to destroy that little skull-flag-cross-whatever-trap-thing that specter monarch used otherwise it used a lot of lightening bolts or something and I even told someone to be careful and do that when we started… for nothing… it couldn’t even pull off his trick anymore and it was already quite sad tbh… Even if it wasn’t too complicated that little mechanic was something but got lost because of the messed up progression…

They rly have the wrong idea btw about what is hard and what is just simply annoying… Also it doesn’t rly have to be that hard or something but more fun/challangeing… even the traps the bosses use are mostly lame… I don’t know velcoffer unfortunately neither the new raids…Maybe those are better but that doesn’t mean other parts of the game should be so plain as it is now… I wish there would be a boss rebalance too.

Otherwise I agree with you but it was better in betas a bit. I don’t say it was perfect but it was a beta and seemed like it could go to the right direction… it didn’t tho. Leveling was slow what was bad for sure but all they did was to give us more exp what made everything easier in the beginning… and become overleveled and stronger than what we should have at that point…

Boss behaviors are bad but you don’t even experience a lot of their moves because you don’t have to do anything against it.
I also think a lot of their moves are not clear enough tho (or also not well adjusted) and close to unavoidable (and I don’t even want to mention lag)… it is not an accident that the forecast of oracle is quite useless too…

Speaking of knockdowns, I have a thing against netherbovine.

I think it was from last year’s event. Netherbovine keeps knocking me down NONSTOP (like, gets knocked again without even getting up). It was a timed event too. I had well over 4 minutes to kill it but didn’t! The blind status effect is permanent too. And what’s worse, pain barrier doesn’t stop the knockdown. What the heck?! Must be bugged…

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By the way… what’s the point of skilling Surespell and Rune of Protection if your Snow Rolling skill gets broken immediately by any mob? Since few weeks ago, the skill is simply utterly useless…

The thing that makes knockdown annoying is that it affects every Class differently.

If a Class e.g. has skills with long skill animations or relies on continuous casting to deal damage,
this Class will suffer way more from spamming knockdown/knockback skills.

Imagine you play Exorcist and not only do you have to account for movement of the boss but also for knockdowns that will interrupt you skill every now and then.
It’s even worse if the boss can also destroy your tile skills like Velcoffer, which can, in combination with knockdown mechanics, render whole Classes useless for certain contents.

It’s fine to have some gimmicky attacks and skills on bosses here and there, but if it’s just to annoy the players and reduce their overall damage potential artificially on top of the defense&HP bulks, it’s too much
(if you have short lived de-buffs to reduce defense and the monster keeps knocking down the party, disabling them to utilize the opened DPS windows, that’s annoying).

There are a lot of features that need to change soon. We need more player-boss interactions to make the game more interesting and more difficult, not just a few mechanics that make the fight last longer but don’t change anything about it [e.g. the Demon Lord changes].

If it keeps flat-line as iterations of attack-recovery-attack-etc without the need to defend or the possibility of enemy retaliation (e.g. countering the player with an attack after he delivered 10 critical blows) the game will just get more annoying in future updates when equipment ends at a flat with Velcoffer equipment that just gets re-ichored with better stat options.