Tree of Savior Forum

Big Ole List of "Quality of Life" Improvement Requests!

General Discussion
#1

Table of Contents:

  • General Requests
  • Class Specific Requests
    1. Swordsman
    2. Wizard
    3. Cleric
    4. Archer

  1. Either the repair system should be changed so that durability loss only occurs on death - or Swordsman should be given an attribute that makes reduces durability loss from non-death by 90%. There’s no reason why one class specifically should have to suffer repair costs after every dungeon run.

  2. Looking For Group needs to be brought into 2016. There’s no reason we shouldn’t be able to boot out inactive party members, and be auto-matched with new ones.

  3. Add-ons should NOT be the only way the game is playable. Map-discovery, Collection management, Monster Information, Chat Interface, etc - should be user-friendly by default and not require addons in order to make the game enjoyable.

  4. These forums, and the STATE OF THE GAME - need to be more diligently checked up on - than the sorry excuse for communication and stability we have now. Orsha as an example - has had broken LFD since maintenance this morning. There has not been an official peep or acknowledgement of this issue at all. It’s as if IMC reboots the server after applying hotfixes and doesn’t even check to make sure everything still works. I dare say that if the server itself were completely “lights out” - we still wouldn’t have heard anything about it from them by now. You need to hire some international staff to moderate your customer communication.

  5. AI-based classes in this game need a lot of love, even more so than other classes - and that’s saying something! Sorcerers, Necromancers, Bokors, Hunters, Falconers, even Paladins (Conversion) - are a grab-bag full of poorly-programmed AI and feel-bad mechanics. Sorcerers basically have to forget they do anything other than summoning for sustainable play, Necro skele’s are super-squishy, Bokor-zombies are slow and unsustainable, hunter pets have a mixture of depression and ADD, and Paladin converted mobs are a nuisance to society at large. If it’s not tiny leash ranges it’s awful SP consumption, squish, or bug-after-bug-after-bug.

  6. Why is there so little information about what skills do in this game? We need a very verbose “skill text” update. Everything from number of multi-hits to weapon requirements to hidden secondary effects - needs to be included in the tooltips. So many people are making horrible build decisions based on the lacking information about skills. Worse yet - we’re trying to divine the secrets of the skills through expensive experimentation - like with Jolly Roger. A complete enigma of a skill!

  7. Mounted classes need to have access to all their skills, or be heavily informed before-hand about which ones won’t work. There are a lot of restrictions on usable skills for Schwarzers and Cataphracts. I’m sure countless people have made poor build decisions due to not knowing that a lot of skills simply aren’t usable on mounts for some reason. Take the time to develop the animations for it - and let those classes use all their skills without issue.

  8. C3 Costumes in the TP Shop need to state that they require C3 of that class in the description. Not me personally but it sucks when you buy a costume thinking you can wear it - only to find out you can’t. Rumor had it that you could wear C3 costumes as long as you had the same base-class of said costume, and I guess thats incorrect?

  9. Fedimian should have a Collection NPC. Uncivilized beasts there be in Fedimian.

  10. Why is there a Personal and Team Storage? Why are we downgrading the banking system from what was designed for Ragnarok Online? Money, items - these things were shareable on RO. The lead developer of ToS is the same developer from RO. How could it come to pass that our trading & storage system is so archaic? I know - we’ve been trying to fight of botting by developing system that are non-issues for bots while highly destructive to players. There should be one bank, account-wide, that everyone has the ability to use. It should be able to hold everything from money to gears to materials.

  11. There should be no drops that are by default untradeable (especially premium items and monster gems). Such as Ledas Shield. There is no justifiable reason why this inconsistency exists amongst gears. Either everything is soulbound - such as in WoW, or nothing is soulbound - such as in RO. This “in between”, inconsistent nonsense needs to be stopped.

  12. Team Level system should be replaced with a similar EXP system to what they have in FFXIV. This means that instead of accumulating levels to increase monster exp for characters, you all characters that are lower level than your highest will receive additional experience in all forms. This is to alleviate the burnout players get when they have to do the exact same quests over and over on their different characters.

Class Specific Requests:

Swordsman:

  1. As stated above, Swordsman suffer harshly for doing their job - in the form of nuisance repair-requirements. Either make it so Swordsman suffer significantly less durability loss for damage received (non-death) - or just change the entire repair system so that the only time durability loss is suffered - is upon death. And then raise the prices of repairs to compensate for the shift in business.

  2. Swordsman as a non-tank role is sub-par and non-existent. The next several bullets will be all about fixing this. You can justify taking a second Archer, Cleric or Wizard in your group due to the nature of the utility and power they provide. That is not the case for Swordsman - you’re either useful as a tank - or you’re sub-par as a DPS.

  3. Give Swordsman C1 either Swashbuckling (and replace the Peltasta skill with something else) - or give Swordsman C1 some sort of smaller-scale AoE aggro skill. Pelt1 is basically a requirement for end-game content on Swordsman. If you don’t have Swash - you might as well have nothing. This suggestion removes that restriction while simultaneously not cheapening the experience for existing Pelt1-2-3 players.

  4. HELLO MCFLY? MAGIC MITIGATION? Right now there is only one magic mitigation skill in the Swordsman tree - and thats Slithering (Rodel2). This means tanking as a Swordsman (especially when you get healer-less parties!) is downright embarassing when it comes to magic damage. The only option aside from going Rodel2 is to just build up a lot of HP and hope you can soak up the damage instead.

  • Fencer: There has long-since been a rumor that timing Flanconnades just right would mitigate magic damage. It would be cool to see this made a reality - and have a legitimate “player skill based” magic mitigation.
  • Perhaps a magic-parry passive attribute for Swordsman C1, or maybe unlockable at Rank5?
  • Maybe make Guarding with a Shield reduce magic damage by X% based on SPR?
  • There are lots of options that can be explored for this really.
  1. Lighten up the weapon requirements! It’s pigeon-holing everybody’s build choices! You want to be a Dragoon? You have to take Hop and/or Cata. Want to be a Rodelero? One-handers only! The only options you really get are sticking with the cookie-cutter builds, or doing a lot of weapon-swapping (oh wait, that’s buggy right now too!)

Wizard:

  1. Wizard C1 and C2 are basically worthless on their own. Sleep is only sometimes (rarely) useful - and Lethargy is great because of the required slash damage attribute and all - but the rest of the skills don’t count for much. For starters - Wiz3 is great, we all know that. That’s why if you want to do serious magic damage - you have to go Wiz3. Surecast is nice and all - but it will never be worth going into Wiz2 just to get that, and then jumping ship to a different class. Energy Bolt - even in ideal situations - is a mana sink with weak damage payout. The SP cost needs to be reduced to roughly 1/8th what it currently is. Earthquake could be fixed by simply giving it a bigger AoE ratio the more levels you put into it.

  2. Pyromancer skills need some damage and mechanical love. Fireball for starters - should have an attribute that lets only the Pyromancer “relocate” it. The damage numbers need to be upped quite a bit for some of the skills as well - to compensate for the fact that mobs have to be standing in the effects in order for them to do damage. Cooldowns should be reduced for skills like Fire Pillar too - its a nice skill and all, but doesn’t warrant that kind of cooldown. Obviously Flare is garbage - needs to just be something else.

  3. Cryomancer too - but not as much. Specifically Ice Blast & Ice Bolt need love. Ice Blast is just wimpy and Ice Bolt has way too long of a cast time for the little damage it adds (most people only level Ice Bolt to get the fast-cast lvl 1 for freezing chance).

  4. Psychokino just needs two things really - Swap & Teleport need to have much faster activation times (their slow activation makes them very un-useful in many situations. Second - Teleport “direction movement” needs to work for mouse users like it does for keyboard users - in that going in a certain direction whilst casting TP will TP you in that direction rather than in random directions.

  5. Thaumaturge needs (by default) longer buff durations, and Swell Body needs to not increase the HP on the mob. Swell buffs are tedious to maintain with their short durations, especially when you have to cast so many. Swell Body on the other hand - is great at low levels where mobs die quick - but is completely worthless at higher levels where only the most-coordinated-of-parties can kill off the mobs in the short duration provided by Swell Body.

  6. Sorcerer summon needs to not drain SP while its out. Also Salamion should cleave with his attacks. Just making a Sorcerer summon useful requires a lot of work and card-eating. Couple that with the fact that most summonable demons suck - AND the fact that you can’t do much else while its out - and its a recipe for boredom. No wonder so many people just AFK farm with their pets - its all they can really do with the strict SP consumption from the demon. Most of us try to have as little SP as possible just to keep our demon downtime low. The SP drain just needs to be removed - so that our summon can function like the Necromancer Shoggoth.

  7. Necromancer needs love in several ways - the most important of which is their ability to gather corpse stacks. Gather Corpse and Disinter aren’t even good for supplemental corpse replenishment. The alternative is to either not use your skills (read: un-fun) - or spend a lot of money at the NPC to buy corpse potions (see: un-fun). Just reduce the corpse requirements for all skills to 5, and then make it so the Necromancer automatically gets a corpse charge for every death on the screen around them. Voila! Fun AND productive!

  8. Sorcerer summons need to show the cooldowns of their skills when riding and when dismounted. Self explanatory.

Cleric:

  1. Add a Cleric C1 attribute that increases the number of heal tiles produced by 1/2/3/4/5. Arguably the most important reason (as far as everyone in your party is concerned!) for going Cleric C2 is to get 10 healing tiles instead of 5. Similar to Pelt1 for Swordsman, a lot of people see Cleric2 as an unspoken requirement to be successful in the class. This should fix that problem - while also not reducing the enjoyability of gameplay for existing Cleric2’s and 3’s.

  2. Cleric Auto-attacks should be based on whatever stat is higher for the Cleric - between INT and STR. A YUGE complaint about Clerics are that their auto-attacks are by default based on STR, which makes it feel weak and clunky for clerics that are INT or SPR based. Just make it so that the auto-attack does damage as if it were using the higher stat that the Cleric has.

  3. Give Cleric1 a “single-target slow-cast resurrection” - either as a 1 point skill, or an attribute. Being in a party with a Priest that refuses to res sucks - even worse is when you’re a Cleric but you didn’t take Priest - and you would totally have res’d that guy if you could. Just give a single-target resurrection skill to Cleric1 that lets them fill that “healer role” in a very small way that will make a huge difference.

  4. Bokor Zombies should by default have the same movement speed as the Bokor. Also Bokor skills should be INT based, not a mix of INT/STR. This should not require a Bokor2 buff skill to work. Leveling as a Bokor sucks because your zombies don’t keep up with you and you have to spam zombie-head to get them to move at a snails pace where you want them to go.

  5. Dievderbys statues should be immovable. Also - let Diev’s use Carve on their own statues to get mats back at a chance and reduce their remaining cooldowns. Sucks to put down owl statues or some other statue - only to have it knocked back and become worthless 2 seconds later. Just make it so they can’t be moved. Letting Dievs take down their own statues for proportional materials and cooldown would be great too.

  6. Sadhu needs love. Sadhu players know this. Specifically Out-of-Body needs a buff in the Ectoplasm department. For those of you that don’t know - Ectoplasm is the name of the auto-attack you get in OOB. It needs to have a higher AoE ratio - and your spirit form should be improved by the buffs your body receives, such as Blessing and Sacrament.

Archer:

Honestly I feel like Archer is pretty well off. There’s only a few QoL changes I’d like to see for them.

  1. Sapper skills need longer uptimes, more damage, lower cooldowns (for some skills like Spike Shooter) - and the traps should be concealed by default in PvP. I think this is pretty self-explanatory. Most folks won’t even consider Sapper3 due to pointless skills like Collar Bomb.

  2. Hunter pets are stupid. This is just a complaint again about the awful AI - but Hunter Skills have so many silly requirements just to get them to work. Companions attack so slowly and weakly as it is - the Hunter skills really just use the pet as a tool. But they usually don’t even work anyways - so your pet either runs into a wall for 10 seconds, stops moving entirely, or hits the wrong enemy that you didn’t even target…

  3. Rapid Fire & Full Draw need to work in mouse mode. Not sure how the rest of y’all do it, but I have to line up enemies in one of the 4 cardinal directions before unleashing Rapid Fire or Full Draw - because it only seems to fire in those directions with mouse mode - and never goes in the direction of the cursor or even to whatever you have targetted. The skills are basically worthless in this state.

  4. Wugushi poisons should not be heavily restricted on application. It is understandable that because of how powerful they are, you don’t want a party of Wugu’s steamrolling everything. Perhaps make it so that just one Wugu per party can apply the poisons. This way things like World Bosses don’t have to be a losing fight for Wugu’s who can’t use their poisons because they are either already up on a boss, or are overwritten by another Wugu.

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#2

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

1 Like
#3

I’d leave it in the general discussions forum for now so it becomes a “discussion” instead of an ignored post over in Suggestions. More people will see it here and may contribute to it.

3 Likes
#4

Yeah they moved the suggestions link to the bottom of the sub-forum list - kind of says where their priorities are. Thanks for the backup :slight_smile:

2 Likes
#5

bokors are actually ment to be int base. that is why they that int convert into str for the zombies

#6

Definitely! But I believe that some of their skills scale directly from STR which is the problem.

#7

oh yeah bwa kayiman #20char

#8

they have a ton of work to do and yet they want to add new classes with the mess they already have

#9

Care to elaborate that? Why would Swordsman need to repair more than other classes? I’m cleric and I certainly need to repair every 2 (full) dungeon runs too.

The only thing I’d change about repair was to reduce the tax on Squires. So it is actually not 5 times more expensive than NPC repair.

I haven’t really played an MMORPG that allowed “Booting out and and rematch” yet. Isn’t it prone for abuse? And if it’s automatic, like no movement for 2 minutes, couldn’t it simply be circumvented by keeping a key pressed?

Yes. I agree.

Dunno, I think with their weekly Q&A they already give more feedback than staff from other MMORPGs I’ve played. Also you really expect them to do a dungeon run on each server after each maintenance to check if it’s still running? That’d be a lot of work. Yeah, dungeon search didn’t work for 2 days on EU server too before and it sucked, but with a bit patience they finally repaired it and gave everyone a dungeon reset scroll.

Only if they also add an class ingredient NPC there, otherwise it would be unfair that classes that need ingredients had to travel back while others don’t.

I honestly don’t really agree with most of the class suggestions because I think it would just create more inbalance. You don’t tackle the actual issues with those changes.

For example the boost on Cleric C2 is important for the balance because it allows getting C2 to be viable still in endgame. And the fact that Cleric can’t resurrect is important so Priest is viable.
Honestly Cleric-type is already the most balanced type. It only needs the zombie buffs from kToS and Sadhu needs to be buffed, the rest is good enough.

Wizard C1/C2 don’t really need changes, C1 has to be taken anyway, C2 has to be taken to get C3, but can also be used for Surespell. Pyromancer is already good damage, the only thing that needs to be fixed about it is that its skills need to scale better into late game. Maybe by adding a class that can increase fire damage. Cryo/Psycho are already good enough. Thaumaturge is good enough, but similar to the Priest buffs like Blessing and Sacrament, the buffs need to be changed so that they scale with something, so they don’t suck in endgame (probably should make it scale with SPR, so there’s a point to get SPR at all for Wizard class).

Swordsman needs fixes, but giving them the taunt skill by default is bad design. Players should have the choice between tank or not tank swordsman. Peltasta should remain unique in that it’s best to tank. It’s just that the other non-tank swordsman classes need something that makes them special too. Either CC or good damage or some other unique feature other classes can’t offer. For example if Swordsman had skills with longer cooldowns than archer skills, but that deal significantly more damage than archer skills even in endgame at the cost that you need to use them on melee range, then that would make them more viable.

1 Like
#10

Care to elaborate that? Why would Swordsman need to repair more than other classes? I’m cleric and I certainly need to repair every 2 (full) dungeon runs too.

The only thing I’d change about repair was to reduce the tax on Squires. So it is actually not 5 times more expensive than NPC repair.

I agree the game should be less punishing on Squires. I kind of think “zero tax” would be the way to go. I mean - you DID sacrifice a circle just to repair afterall…

As far as my statement on punishment. Swordsman needs to repair after every dungeon run - we can’t usually even eek out 2 runs before needing to repair. This is because tanks are constantly taking hits - which Guard is great for - but armor still loses durability quick even with successful Blocks (the Shield & Weapon however are still pretty much pristine after a dungeon run - just the armors get broken). Swordsman are also dependent on their gears and more likely to get them broken than other classes just by nature of how they are played in comparison to ranged classes or casters.

I haven’t really played an MMORPG that allowed “Booting out and and rematch” yet. Isn’t it prone for abuse? And if it’s automatic, like no movement for 2 minutes, couldn’t it simply be circumvented by keeping a key pressed?

Pretty much every game with an LFG system has this ability - such as WoW, FFXIV, GW2, etc. As far as the potential for it to be abused - it can’t be as bad as the current system where you get players who literally AFK the entire dungeon - or the trolls that AFK only up until you get to the last boss and they go to collect their cubes. Meanwhile the party can do nothing about it.

Dunno, I think with their weekly Q&A they already give more feedback than staff from other MMORPGs I’ve played. Also you really expect them to do a dungeon run on each server after each maintenance to check if it’s still running? That’d be a lot of work. Yeah, dungeon search didn’t work for 2 days on EU server too before and it sucked, but with a bit patience they finally repaired it and gave everyone a dungeon reset scroll.

I do not think it is unreasonable for the people running the game to be made aware that their party finder system is broken. Many people log in only for the sake of running dungeons - yet it simply does not work in any capacity outside of manually creating a premade. Dungeon reset scrolls are nice and all - but they don’t solve the problem of poor communication. Weekly communication is also nice - but does not make up for the fact that there is only an “illusion of communication” coming from these STAFF accounts.

Only if they also add an class ingredient NPC there, otherwise it would be unfair that classes that need ingredients had to travel back while others don’t.

I have no reason to be against that.

I honestly don’t really agree with most of the class suggestions because I think it would just create more inbalance. You don’t tackle the actual issues with those changes.

If you try to balance a game around 1v1 PvP - you will always fail. Most of the “imbalance issues” people talk about are either referring to a very loud minority of classes that have outstanding balance issues (which is not what I’m trying to address) - or people complaining that they aren’t winning duels while sitting in town. 1v1 PvP should never be accounted for.

For example the boost on Cleric C2 is important for the balance because it allows getting C2 to be viable still in endgame. And the fact that Cleric can’t resurrect is important so Priest is viable.
Honestly Cleric-type is already the most balanced type. It only needs the zombie buffs from kToS and Sadhu needs to be buffed, the rest is good enough.

Nothing I suggested takes away from the viability of Cleric C2. They will play largely the same - only with more healing tiles by default - and also that players have the ability to choose something other than Cleric C2 without having to worry about losing their spot in a party due to too few healing tiles. Same goes for my Wimpy-Resurrection suggestion. Priests are not taken into parties for Res in the first place (even fewer actually use it when needed ANYWAYS!). My suggested Cleric-based Res would in no way be a replacement for Revive or Resurrection - which are far more powerful and useful than what I’ve proposed.

Wizard C1/C2 don’t really need changes, C1 has to be taken anyway, C2 has to be taken to get C3, but can also be used for Surespell.

There should not be a Circle in ANY class that is so useless that the only reason it is taken is as a stepping stone to the next rank. Wiz C2 is just that - it is unreasonable to go into it just for Surecast, which is the only thing it offers. Similarly, “Wiz1 has to be taken anyway” is a poor reason to justify leaving a class as it is - when Wizards, Clerics and Swordsman are given many tools and utilities that they will continue to use throughout their entirety. You don’t see Swordsman checking their Gung Ho’s and Pain Barriers at the door just because they made it to Rank3 do you?

Pyromancer is already good damage, the only thing that needs to be fixed about it is that its skills need to scale better into late game.

You literally just said one thing and then immediately refuted it in the same sentence. Pyro damage is great until you hit level 80, then it quickly turns to garbage as all your skills are either on too high of a cooldown to use frequently, require the enemy to stand in a very specific spot, or they just get knocked across the room by every melee player swinging in a half mile radius of a Fireball. These are legitimate issues that need to be accounted for when they dole out damage numbers and implement mechanics.

Swordsman needs fixes, but giving them the taunt skill by default is bad design. Players should have the choice between tank or not tank swordsman. Peltasta should remain unique in that it’s best to tank. It’s just that the other non-tank swordsman classes need something that makes them special too. Either CC or good damage or some other unique feature other classes can’t offer. For example if Swordsman had skills with longer cooldowns than archer skills, but that deal significantly more damage than archer skills even in endgame at the cost that you need to use them on melee range, then that would make them more viable.

I’m not disagreeing with you - you make very good points and I like your idea about higher-damage/higher-cooldown skill choices for Swordsman as a whole. I also don’t think that every Swordsman should have to tank. Every class should be able to take party Spot-5 without having to worry about being an ugly duckling. That said - I don’t think giving Swashbuckling (or some smaller-scale inferior version of it) to Swordsman will ruin this archetype-ecosystem. Peltasta will still be the best option if you’re planning on going the tank route - but the value that Swash brings to the table is too high for it to be the only instance of its effect - and it places an unreasonable expectation on all Swordsman builds to include it due to the risk of being excluded from a party just because they don’t have it. Similar to 10 healing tiles.

1 Like
#11

I kinda have to chime in here and agree with you. As much as I like my pyromancer, my experience in dungeons has been exactly this. If it isn’t someone leveling up pushing the enemies away, it’s someone using knockback skills to push enemies away.

This game basically makes combat MOBILE where enemies and players are constantly being forced to move, yet look at how many skills require players or enemies to stand in one spot for them to actually matter? Plus you gotta wait forever on the cooldowns so you’re doing absolutely nothing after your skills just got wasted on a knockback.

I really do consider this sucky.

1 Like
#12

You forgot one thing for sorcerer let us see the cool downs on boss skills when using ride.

1 Like
#13

Good call - will append.

#14

Trading system:
-being able to share and transfer silver to other characters on the same account
-make untradable items to be tradable, it’s stupid when you drop a rare item or recipe on a character that can’t use it but really need on a different character, this also includes monster gems and cards
-remove the 2-day wait time to collect sales from the market board
-more slots for Team Storage

1 Like
#15

I presume current Team level system is just a placeholder its balls.

The game should check if characters are under the level of your highest and provide them a exp bonus to their cards until they’re within 2 levels of your highest level character. Having people go through all the same quests continually is well dated and absolutely doesn’t function for a game with a class system this vast where people want to have alts and take on many different combinations.
They’re shooting themselves in the foot.

3 Likes
#16

It does, 10 healing tiles is more than enough. If you gave it to the default cleric, everybody will have it and then it won’t be special anymore. It is nice how it currently is. Wanna be a healer? Take at least cleric C1.

They actually are. That’s their main party purpose really.

Surecast is a second reason.

No it isn’t. If the default class already offers something useful, then you take a lot away from class versatility. All other classes in the game can be taken or not taken, but the first one, everybody will have to take, so it should not offer anything good. No more than 5 healing tiles, no skills that are still as good as other skills in endgame, no unique core abilities like taunting.

What I’m saying is there shouldn’t be any changes to Pyro that make its skills stronger in general. There should be changes to Pyro, that make its skills scale better to endgame, without making them stronger in early/mid-game.

#17

Yes please.

Yes. There is too much stuff untradable in this game. More tradable items will also make the market more interesting. Give players a choice whether they want to hunt a rare item all day or just go somewhere else and earn some silver and buy that item. Don’t force them to do the same dungeon a hundred times or kill the same monster 10000 times.

IF it helps to remove illegally obtained silver before it’s spread to legit players, I think it should stay as it is. It hardly is a problem at all for normal players, only for those that get a lot of silver at once with single transaction.

I already like their solution by making you gain storage slots via collections. But one single slot by default is still really weird.

#18

with so many problems to fix, is this game ever going to be in a optimal state?

#19

I don’t know why I am amused by this post.
You’ve made some good points but seriously some of your suggestions are just plain stupid.

This is basically like asking a circling on archer1 and quickcast on wiz1.

Yeah IMC why wont you let us shoot arrows from musket?!

Yeah let us have Running Shot on QS1, Split Arrow on Scout1, Pass and Haste on Chrono1. Screw you IMC!

Tadaaa~

Yeah just give us the double exp and double loot rate without stipulation! Screw your ideas IMC!

Yeah so afk farmers wont need a 3PP anymore.

Let’s ask for a whole map heal tiles instead.

This one basically sums up who you are as a gamer. And obviously the reason why you’ve made these suggestions.

3 Likes
#20

totally agree, you should run IMC.