Tree of Savior Forum

TO IMC Staff || BOT Users will retaliate

General Discussion
#151

In my findings, Incorrect. I’ve done a lot of these missions, probably over 150 across all my characters, they tell you a random map to go to in your level range and either grab material from said map, or kill monsters. I feel it’s one of the games best ways to aid exploration. Also, even my 235 swordsman can solo these quests, if a swordsman can, there isn’t an excuse :smiley: And they are literally walks in the park on my cleric(212) and archer(264).

Weren’t we just talking about how silver is a mechanism used to slow progress anyway through attributes? This way they(IMC) can choose how quickly we get there with only dailies. I feel with the proposed theory, it does work rather well. It also hinders the botter the most, random maps for random missions. While you can code for it, it’s a lot harder than other methods.

However, if you feel it lowers exploration, create more silver gains for simple 100% the maps, maybe even included in that 100% tie creature kill quests, then the wings of vibora merchant becomes more applicable for income, not only cards.

Adding things that weight that much I’m avidly against. But having some random item quests on each map that give rewards according on drop rate could be rather nice, I think it should change every couple hours or so though. A random feature does through a small wrench into the spokes, another thing to code around.

Overall yes, I do like the ideas. And as said, most things can be absolutely coded around, so the goal is to add FEATURES™ that add more things for the average gamer to do, while also slowing bot progress.

@FlanFlan said it the best so far, just about everything under the sun can be coded around. You can’t ruin your player’s experience in attempts to halt botting. Earlier I said clever mechanics can help, but the people botting are typically as clever, if not more clever than the developer.

The problem with some of the implementations we talk about currently even, are the load screens in this game are terrible. It takes “literally” forever to load into a map. It’s absolute trash. Optimizations are needed to even make merc post dailies viable, since party quests are already mostly loading screens and turns ins, with no active playing involved in comparison.

#152

just get GM ingame. (all it needs is warp and recall commands)

do manual patrolling
recall/warp the said player.
conducts human-testing-analysis

(someone already told me that ‘bots’ can be programmed to reply, so it would be hard to distinguish them from real players)

really, this is one of the dumbest thing i’ve ever known. there are lots of things/words that can be use to interrogate a bot. unless you are stupid to ask ‘are you a bot’ which are generics lines.

3-5mins recording for the said human-testing-analysis is required
if proven bot, report the player already.
if not, nothing to worry about.

days later. . .

the said player caught botting filed a ticket saying he wasn’t botting
replied the ticket with the recorded ‘video’ while checking his character ingame.

oh, before i forgot, someone else already said that no one is sane enough to do 24/7 patrol ingame.

really? why would you patrol 24/7 when all they need to do is patrol 2-3hours a day? having the “THREAT” of getting caught with a GM ingame means ‘END’ to them. and that 2-3hours a day is actually a good duration to instill more ‘FEAR’ on this botters. random times, random places.

i specially wanted to mention those who are ‘LEGIT’ players who turned into 'BOTTING-PLAYERS" because they are lousy to hunt at low level map themselves. (i have some list of lv280 character who are constantly botting at certain maps)

what’s the Downside?

there aren’t GM ingame…

#153

Yeah I agree it is one of the best ways to urge a player to explore more.

Maybe it is just me, but asking a semi support cleric to go Rathboy Lake (268 map) to farm a low drop % item is really hard. Can’t imagine those who took full support (eg, cryo1>linker2>chrono3) how will they feel if the sole way to gain silver is from missions like that. It just feels the game is like alienating their build.

Next is with the chance of missions giving more silvers will inevitably increase/inflate the market price of some commodity items. Players do like to follow the path of least resistance, and most of them (myself included) buy materials just to complete daily missions.

What will happen if a daily quest rewards 100k silver requires a blue spion leather to complete? We should get that “Blue spion leather” turn in daily as a common quest during 220+ levels. How will you price “Blue spion leather” when you know players can potentially use it to gain 100k silver + a lvl9 exp card, moreover used in many recipes?

As someone who is in sales and marketing I believe that you are better equipped to answer this than me.

Yeah just about everything under the sun can be coded around, can’t really run from that. It isn’t easy to hinder bot progress while not impact the actual player’s experience for the game, which is why it leads to us discussing about the pros and cons of each other’s suggestions.

The Vendor mat weight suggestion is put forth to hinder the bot’s ability to farm for an extended period of time. Players who quest normally should have not much problems turning them in if the npc is placed in a convenient location on the map (next to quest npcs). Weight limit of the vendor mat can be tweaked to further match an average player’s gaming time.

For example: a 3000 weight worth of vendor mats every 45 mins is still quite managable.

#154

I agree with your idea of a support character not being able to hold their own. But they are a support, that was a decision choice to alienated ones own damage to support effectively. You can say as a semi-support the entire game is against you, because you need others, and you’d be right. A support character is even worse off, yet they couldn’t farm effectively in the first place.

The fix to quest objectives, is just make quest items that drop from mobs at a % flagged to only drop if “X quest” is active. It doesn’t need to be a current item. They have the drop visuals, and the artwork they can steal from other items. It would literally take someone 30 seconds to whip it up if the database is in any order. Then another 2 minutes to write a flag call on the quest, then you implement the drop on the mob you have to hunt. Which shouldn’t take that long either, more time should be locating the document than actually writing it up.

You are a semi support cleric, you don’t need to heal unfortunately. EVERYONE ELSE in the game needs loads of HP potions. I carry about 100 HP potions at all times, and around 30 SP potions. At the same time, there is no effective way to sort inventory. I have almost 8k weight limit, and I’m always around 7.5-7.8k weight. More weight doesn’t help.

#155

But you are taking away the ability to earn silvers for support characters… currently now no matter how low full support characters’ dps are, they can still earn silvers by killing monsters that don’t take them long to kill.

With reduced silvers from monsters to 0 and putting silver gain via merc dailies, support characters have no choice but to ask others for help. Even that will post a challenge since that merc dailies are random, it will be hard for the other player to even have the same quest.

All character builds, no matter support or not, should be able to earn silvers. Support already get reduced rewards due to not dpsing much in missions/dungeons… now to add this feature in is like rubbing talts to their wound.

Totally don’t understand. I suppose you mean creating new ‘items’ just for merc quest sake and not use the current commodities like “Blue spion leather”? You can use the vendor items since they are currently no different from “new created items”, their purpose now is only to vendor (for meager amounts of silver)

It is build dependent. I’m a Dievdirby3 and I carry 1.5-2k logs every time in addition to SP potions, block potions, magic attack potions and skill scrolls. Same like you I’m always at 95-97% weight. Inventory sucks now, the filtering and sorting is atrocious and I hate it. This is the part of the UI that gets a 1/10 from me based on UI/UX.

Anyway the original intent of the weight limitation is to hinder bots by making them unable to gain more vendor mats (to trade for silver) once they are at full weight. I don’t think my suggestion is full-proof though and it definitely needs some adjustment. Really glad you point that out.

Ideally after all equipment + potions and whatnot, the player should be around 50-60% weight limit. The weight will hit 95-97% after 30-40mins of farming, in which the player can trade those vendor mats for silver, reducing the weight back and continue questing/farming. If IMC can balance it like that then the player won’t feel the hindrance from the weight limit at all.

The 16/6 kToS patch addressed the weight issue by reducing the weight of basic potions (YAY). Hopefully they extend it to all other potions and to iToS.

#156

Yes, they may deserve a second chance.
However, they should still get punished accordingly to what they did.
If they RMTed/botted silver or items, wipe their silver and/or items.
If they botted to gain levels, delete or delevel their characters.
Etc.

That’s fair punishment for breaking the rules this way and they should feel lucky if they can keep their account unbanned.

Well, the problem is that free-to-play games, despite many people not paying for the game, still make more money than subscription-based games, due to cashshops and several people spending hundreds, if not thousands, of dollars per month on the game.

#157

From a profit standpoint I can’t argue with you. But I still feel that from a gamer standpoint, they really deteriorate the quality of a game causing it to lose a lot of its potential.

And if you aren’t careful, you can easily spend loads more money in a free to play cash shop than you would in a subscription pay to play game per year.

It’s wonderful for business absolutely. Just wish we could get a happy medium where quality and profit intermingle peacefully.

#158

Umm off-topic but… Which anime is that GIF from? I might want to watch it.

on-topic: I hope those botters get IP banned instead so they NEVER come back. Their account should be permanently removed from existence too.

#159

Kyoukai no Kanata however I’m 100% sure that is a photoshop edit, it wasn’t her middle finger being used there lol.

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#160

Aww bummer… Still seem like an interesting anime though, I’ll put it on my watchlist.

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