Tree of Savior Forum

Still disappointed with Kab 2 and Oracle 3

Class and Rank Cleric
#1

I was hoping these two rank 8 classes would get buffed up in some patches after the release. But it’s been a few weeks since kToS’ release of rank 8 classes and I still don’t see any major changes in those two classes.

They feel extremely underwhelming when compared to the other 4 rank 8 cleric choices (PD 2, Inqui, Taoist, and even Druid 3). Are the korean players not complaining about it at all?

I know they’re meant to be support classes, but even their support skills feel completely garbage when compared to other choices we have.

For Kab 2:

  • Double Chance is horrible. Long preparation time, long cooldown, many skill points requirements, and only lasts 1 hit.

  • Clone has a stupidly long cooldown, it doesn’t provide extra exp so it’s not even useful at grinding. It also takes a long preparation and might not even be worth skill points.

  • Merkabah’s attributes are okay, but it’s not enough to save the class at rank 8. You have ~10 seconds of invulnerability with 45 sec cooldown which can be adquired with other lower rank classes easily (Mackangal, Safety Zone, Ausrine…).

  • The rest of the skills are requirements for the really terrible skills described above (Notarikon, Gematria). Reduce level is pretty useless and Ein Sof requires you to heal back to full hp every recast even if you had 100% upkeep on it.

For Oracle 3:

  • Gender Change requires some really rare materials to be used. It’s a “for fun” skill that’s really expensive to be used. How’s this any useful?

  • Fortell is easily replaceable by other better invulnerability skills. Compare it to Sterea Trofh at lv 15 for example, It has shorter cooldown, no necessity to move around with the skill, 100% invulnerability chance instead of 65%, and same duration. Fortell is literally worse (or equal) in every aspect.

  • Death Sentence is still not that useful even with “only” 150 seconds cooldown. It’s still too much of a cooldown and mobs still take 20 seconds to die (it has a really small AoE too).

  • Prophecy’s new attribute is a joke. It’s flat damage per attribute level. Very similar to Arcane Energy’s attribute.

  • Twist of Fate can be useful in very specific situations, but just like Kab 2’s Merkabah, it’s not enough alone to save this class.

  • The rest of the Oracle’s skills either don’t go past lvl 1 (Resetting, Clairvoyance, Forecast), or are about as useful at lvl 5 as lvl 15 (Counter Spell).

Sorry if this sounds a lot like a rant, but I’m really bothered by how IMC is terrible at balancing things. Has anyone found real utility for these classes yet? Not even a single hidden combo that I can hope for? Are those classes just utter garbage and nobody is really trying them out in kToS?

15 Likes
#2

Merkabah is so meeeeeh. And it seems you cannot lvl it up more than lvl 5 o_O.

But you have Revenged Sevenfold lvl 10 > 100% additional damages.

Now for Oracle, Fortell is really strange. I don’t know how you can actually use it. Maybe it will work with Chronomancer, the more you turn around the circle fast, the more you have invincibility, would be OP !

Death Sentace, yeh for PvE content, not really useful.

Twist of Fate sounds amazing on paper, it’s litteraly a counter to TrashCryo in PvP, or anyone with too much HP.

Most of Circle 3 are not really rewarding on this game, and it happens a lot with Cleric tree. I think both Kabba and Oracle are a good pick at C1, I can’t say if it’s a waste at C2/3, and we don’t know yet KabbaC3.

#3

The problem is that there is no balance, what so ever.

Krivis 2/3 was a sh*t class till an handle of players figured out how to abuse meltis (outside from the cntrll of closed team alpha testing, you can bet it) and the only way they had to “balance” the class was to add a focussed R8 class for it, plus buffing druid transformation (gogo lighting mobs) to make zaibas do damage.

pally 1-3 was in the same situation till they added wheel + conviction iteration.

Oh Sh*t! Is wheel / conviction too stronk?
Let’s nerf Zaicai to prevent krivis 1/ pd 1 pally mostruosity! Too much DPS and utility… Emergency fix! And who cares if we destroy one of the few reasons to still go SPR priest in PvE…

Monk is still horrible, let’s bet R9 will have a super stronk iteration with it.

Do we fail to balance a class? No problem guys, just add a super OP iteration in further rank to fix that class.

So, this is one of the WORST way to design classes in a MMo:

a) too many classes, they can not check all the possibille iteration, and this super pushed skills (talisman, wheel) can become a big iussue once abused

b) to make further “balance” they random nerf other builds (even kill tier 2 builds) to keep under controll whatever they are pushing

Let’s see for how much time I can handle this:" oh sry, you have to reroll couz we random killed one of your skills and we don’t give any compensation… Are u still dreaming about respec?"

They are gonna lose the player base while keeping this lazy, lazy game balance design…

I can forsee what is coming next (r9).

Dedicated class for monk

Dedicated class for spirit users -> kabba 3 could be a thing with 1 pushed skill, spirit can rase back from the grave with 1 totally “balanced-KAPPA” new spirit skill at R9.0

Let’s keep the “balance” going.

3 Likes
#4

Agreed.

Though clone is even worse, said clones exist for skill level x 1 seconds. what a joke.

And foretell is 40% base chance with +3% per skill level. So 55% at lvl 5, 58 with divine might. It’s even worse.

Rank 8 classes info is out has the links the skill level effects btw.

#5

Merkabah’s attributes is not just defense thing. There is a bonus damage as well

Not the best buff for sure but still it’s nice if you’re not drunk with DPS. It’s really rare to meet Linker C3 for example that can boost entire party’s performance

#6

and counterspell 15 is r0x

#7

The main reason I’m going oracle 3 is for pvp. 10 prophecy stacks is simply not enough, especially vs rush/restrain combo. It disappears in seconds

#8

Oracle 3 can work out, but the builds that come with it are of a wide variety. Too many players are focused on a one build does it all. Learn to work without certain skills and see how focusing on certain strengths of a class will greatly increase your utility.

Skills like Twist of Fate and Death Sentence are to penalize opponents for going in too close and without preparation. The buff on death sentence sounds small, but death sentence is either a lv 1 or lv 10 kind of skill. Catching a cleric off guard that doesn’t have status immunity/revive ready can guarantee their death with lv 10 death sentence.

Prophecy and Counter Spell are the guaranteed skills to learn. Higher levels simply allow for greater positioning.

Forecast and Foretell are your chance skills. Not always in your favor, but grateful for when it is.

#9

Sounds great in theory, but in practice Oracle 3 is simply garbage when compared to the other rank 8 choices. The reasons that make it so bad are written in my main post.

Just compare the amount of Inquisitors or PD 2 players to Oracle 3 players. It’s not even a fair comparison.

The people who were excited to play Oracle 3 just rerolled into something else after they saw how bad it was.

And i’m just going to leave it here that level 5 or level 15 Counter Spell makes no practical difference.

#10

This is basically comparing Oracle 2 vs Kabba and PD. Oracle 2 is simply terrible on paper, but it is quite possible to make Oracle 2 work, the design was to do a lv 1 death sentence combined with higher levels of Prophecy and Counter Spell. Extra points will go to Arcane Energy.

Oracle 3 on the other hand, has too many skills to make it work efficiently. To be everything will leave you short-handed overall. Work with what your previous ranks allow you to be, and I’m quite sure the potential of Oracle 3 will pan out well.

#11

twist of fate seems useless, deals 40% dmg but they heal rapidly, when wizards an do 100% without them healing. if its able to use on bosses to kil lhtem while theyre at 40% health i guess it isnt useless, but i dont htink thats how its working.

fortell should give some attack buff, instead of a chance of invulnerability, or both. not fair when you compare to a rank 5 skil thats way better and does the same thing.

gender chage shouldnt have to require a rare item.

for kabba 2… i think that kabba 3 will be cool, they are getting a snake dmg/buff skill, and hopefully a golem.

for double chance, it should have more than 1 hit, its terrible.

and clone should atleast give exp

#12

Agreed with what OP says about Kabbalist C2. Can’t really comment much about oracle though as I don’t have experience in it.

One thing which I’m happy about for Kabbalist1 is the current speed and delay of Merkabah. It doesn’t deal really a lot of damage (around 3-4k per wheel for INT build) but it still is a worthy offensive spell for Kabbalist.

In C2 Merkabah is changed to a defensive type spell instead. From the ktos videos it does give a +10% damage bonus hit whenever the player is within the buff radius. It has around 10-12secs of active, moving “safety wall”. Not really that thrilled to have 1 lesser offensive spell to gain 1 more defensive spell when the rest of the C2 skills are so lackluster.

Double Chance should be changed to a party buff instead, with a 20 secs up time and a 1 minute cooldown. The buff still doesn’t do anything but it will multiply the next hit on a mob inflicted with Notarikon/Gematria. This makes the kabbalist able to use the Double Chance + Notarikon/Gematria skill up to 4 times in the span of 20 secs. This is more worthy for a support build imo since we have to invest so many points in 3 skills just to get this effect.

#13

CounterSpell 15 is worlds better than 5. It means more people can enter it, so you need to have at least counterspell 10 to have it be good for GvG.

Fortell could also have pvp uses since it moves it can provide mobile invulerability.

#14

It’s not worlds better. You can still tell your guild peeps not to keep entering and leaving it’s AoE and the skill level won’t make a difference. Sure, if you play in an uncoordinated guild things might get tricky.

But you know, my point here is: If skill levels did something more important to Counter Spell, like increasing the bubble’s duration, then I would consider having the skill at lvl 15 important (thus Oracle c3 slightly better). If you go Oracle c3 you won’t get Counter Spell because you need it higher level, you will get it because you lack anything better to get.

Prophecy is indeed important leveling up high but Counter Spell isn’t.

It’s not 100% invulnerability and people can still knock you away from it. Also, I can’t see how a “moving invulnerability area” is of any advantage. Having an individual invulnerability buff (Mackangal or Ausrine) or having a static invulnerability AoE (Sterea Trofh, Safety Zone, etc) is much more useful and reliable.

In PvP or GvG I’d be even more concerned about Fortell because it means anyone can predict your movement. They can just pop up an ice wall or a pole of agony in the direction where your Fortell will be and hit the jackpot.

1 Like
#15

GvG has 15 people, even with divine might everyone can’t enter a CS 6.

#16

Should add to the fact that when you dispel enemy circles, that counts towards the target number.

#17

I sent a ticket voicing my complains on oracle, days after rank 8 information was released.

Their reply could be seen here

Untitled.jpg1368×1544 560 KB

#18

Probably Gender Change will be the only skill that will be modified. If Foretell was modified, it would probably be in the sense that it can dispel any field it runs into.

#19

has that been tested? I don’t think that is the case, otherwise removing heal tiles would cancel it right away and that doesn’t happen.

#20

Not sure how much has changed, but I do remember when I had a lv 10 CS, I took about 10 tiles in TBL and while still up, the number that went in and out was close to 15.