Tree of Savior Forum

Feedback on the Grind

Suggestions
#7

Only 2 jobs can owerkill archer and warrior( monk no sure) are you noob ? no all people play archer or warrior for owerkill mobs. use your intellect, no all have the same kill speed too, why something classe need quest for lvling are you kid for no listen that ?
You want patry ? try find a patry when ppl no need you ? go play a priest full int for become druid or pay a reset talent 20 dollor when you hit that ranked. most ppl come more stupid every days, no all classes is the same !!! no all ppl too!!!

Only more quest can balanced that, most ppl like play solo out dungeon, because most ppl here have played played many mmorpg and don’t need again find friend or anoher for leave in 3 monch after.

Many ppl come here make a feedback, exp is good, or speaking about grind or owerkill other thing limited only for warrior or archer ! then every class can do that warrior or archer can ? a kid kown no all classe is the same why i tell that ppl who make that noob feedback is stupid.

English is no my main. haha enjoy your very limited intellectuel, most ppl leave magic classes for go physical classes why ?

What priest will choose int priest or str priest ? monk or krivis for heal ? the world turn around you ? for tell ppl leave if you no like grind ? you don’t want delect too magic ranked in that game ? because magic classes can’t grind like a physical or bcause with your intellect limited ppl don’t kown play but magic and physical is the same ?

#8

As for all the Filthy casuals, I can agree to a curtain point. But the reason why video games are getting worse every year are because of casuals. Every game and there mother are catering to casuals cause the are a large portion of the community. But Casuals never stick around long. For example Fallout 4 came out and i noticed a population drop heck even one of my close friends stopped. The hard core players are the ones that stick around for the long run which in turn makes the game successful. Not short term sales.

World of Warcraft is the king for Filthy casuals. New raid comes out they charge everyone for it. Everyone completes the content in a month or so time and then there subscriber counts drop. But then again that’s there marketing strategy since the game is old as hell.

I have a full time job and a social life and i have been playing since day one of this beta and i’m only level 119.
I’m not Going to complain about getting max level nor will i ever. I’m not crazy about grinding either but it gives me something to look forward to. When i get bored of grinding ill do other things. make gear, custom items, brew potions, explore maps trying to find more side quest. etc

Beta isn’t meant to get max level but it would be nice.

For beta testing purposes i believe the rates should be a lot higher in order for everyone to find more broken build that will need balancing before release. But that’s it!

Tree of Savior is a grindy game period. If you know anything about its back story, theirs nothing i need to explain.

i’m currently over killing monsters my level and im getting a level and hour about. not to bad. I would say what the monster is but i don’t need anymore congestion haha

4 Likes
#9

False, have never been confirmed.

#10

Tosbase has monsters and quests available, entire zones, that we do not have in this beta. Coincidentally or not these also happen to fill out the “gaps” a bit.

The reason we have to grind for days and days running in circles in the same map right now (Demon Prison I’m looking at you) is because of those gaps that happen. We’re saving cards so that we can get beyond that problem, but, it appears that specific problem won’t be there later. I’m sure at release there will still be grind walls, somewhere, and you’ll have to hunker down and really get to it. Considering though that 200 will still be early game I do not imagine there will be a single delay in getting there once the content has been balanced. Saving cards to the extent that we are (over the course of nearly 20 levels in some cases for all quest content) just to grind seems to me to be a temporary thing.

1 to 140 is smooth sailings without having to save every card and I imagine the game at full release will be more in lines with that. To help balance the grind and quest rewards I imagine the quest objectives will eventually become harder to obtain as well. Kill 10 of these? How about kill 100. You get the grind and the quest rolled into one so that progression isn’t stifled and can still cater to both kinds of players.

3 Likes
#11

You speak about Fallout 4 and wow, the hardcore player you see in B2P( buy to play game) or F2p game is not the same. In F2p game most hardcare play 100% free because can grind for get all free, buy item cach shop from crusa ppl etc.

In F2p game, is no attactrive for casu ppl, the game will shut down, but in B2P game every buy the game befor played it, the dev get the money back and that good for everyone, but in free to play ?

You make casu leave, the game will shut down, diablo 2, buy to play, is be subcription first, every game who be buy to play or suscription get alive for a long years, every f2p who only have hardcore shut down.

Any a team or community hardcore played won’t stay a game alive, “Lunia” etc the liste is very long game i can tell you.

Why you see most dev try touch casu ppl, because casu ppl who make money, casu ppl who make the game more update, casu ppl who make the game more balanced etc, a game can’t survive wathout casu.

Who care about hardcore ? the game is no e-sport like smite or LOL game but in that game casu who make the game alive, because hardcore get money or farm for get all in free from the game, but is no hardcore who make casu stay, because that game is good no more, casu enjoy play 2h a day or lets and buy skin.

Casu leave or stay about 3 monch ? who care because in that time casu spend alot money in game,because the game good, and more casu will play it and spent money in it.

Better get 2 million casu who spend 20 dollor in 3 monch and leave, then 200 hard core and won t spend any dollor and stay in 10 years.

See H1Z2, is in alpha and 2 millions buy from casu, the game have 1 only 1 good mode, casu won’t get boring, why many casu buy it.

In tos you see a movie on youtube from a job you want play, but is ranked 6 and 7, you are 1 casu, juste for play the classe you want enjoy, you need to play for 8 monch ++ in casu style.

When you see the test of the game, you see is grinding, and casu don’t have any chance get that ranked. and you kown many game will out, no care about a casu leave in 6 monch for another game, because you will get money when the casu played your game, but you make the game hard core, you won t will get money and the game will shut down in f2p model.

Many mmorpg go B2p or suscription after go f2p but it alive !! because get alot money from casu befor they left.

Hardcore player don’t make game alive ! and hard core play in B2p is not same in f2p game, plus game b2p game get money, f2p no sure get any money.

See call of duty every game who out the solo compagne be small, 18h total gameplay etc, but get million dollor, because casu. you can have alot exemple.

Me i prefer spent money in a game a reach the end, or get high lvl content with enjoy, but in a game i will pass miilion hour just for get high lvl content grind boring, i don’t will spent any centime like most here, because you no sure get end content in that noob game.

You prefer buy a movie 90min and you see the end or a movie free too see 6000min and you kown you will won’t see the end ? And you kown it have many other movie you want see. hard core( idiot) or casu( intellect) ?

A game is same, 1 time you want play fps, another time mmorpg, another time hack slash, or moba, need for speed etc.

1 Like
#13

Call of duty is a horrible game! its the same garbage every year. with very minor changes. Yet casuals keep spending there money to play a story game for 6 hours and pooof $60 dollars gone! (which i don’t understand) multiplayer is the worth in any game IMO. But this is just me.

H1Z1 is a beta game and i even purchased it (for multiplayer purposes). But way to many hackers.

Tree Of Savior i could care less about the back story. All i care about is PVP. THE GRIND IS WELL WORTH.
whether it be for specific gear that drops at (0.10% from a boss that spawns every hour) or leveling your base or class level for better skills. It’s a rewarding satisfaction that shouldn’t be handed to you.

I not saying this game is hardcore game But its history has always been grinding. ToS is way easier then what Ragnarok. Almost spoon feeding you.

People always complain the game is to long or to hard or this is OP. Instead of looking at ways around it.
That’s my problem! Is that every game is dumbed-down. which in turn makes the grinding feel worse.
I will gladly accept that its a beta and not everything is included but more of the general complains i read everyday.

If Tos has a cash shop system of micro transactions i would be fine with that if they need to make money. Or if they are going to charge full price for the game i would be fine as well. Just make sure there is not lag fest and everything works. And do check and balances as the game progresses.

3 Likes
#14

Yea but i add befor sorry, ppl have plastation 4 or xbox one or other game like moba, hack $ slash,mine craft etc, if in the first lvl casu ppl got boring, the game will no alive, because a game is no a woman or a boy, ppl want play no make life in a game.

You can be the most fanboy in all world of TOS, next monch or years a new game will out, you will leave TOS for try the other, but if Tos is no boring, you will back time of time for play etc and spend money in it.

Why every guilde, make forum or multigaming guilde, because most ppl can’t play a game a life, only limited or retarded ppl, that can. don’t be absurde of hard core or not.

I give you a exemple why hard core player is a joke, you are hard core or no life ? why you leaved your precedent game hard core and come play TOS ? why you do no stay in your game ? you be an hard core when you started playet TOS ?

You see hard core player is a fake, joke, every new game you will listen a noob call i m hard core, because all are joke.

And the same another in 2016 when new game will out, they will leave TOS and try the new game and make again a feedback, omg the exp is too easy no listen casu player make the game more hard !!! i m a hard core troll !! i leave every game and i tell every new game i m hard core need slow exp in game or other thing.

But the best they don’t spend a centime in a game, that is a hard core gamer, is a troll. in pvp too hard core is troll, win only when they get 50 lvl more. why they want slow exp because can play 8h a day.

And they tell i m supra god, i hit lvl 200 in close beta, the exp is fine, all other is noob, don’t kown play why they won’t be lvl 200, but i will give you tips blabla. “retarded ppl you see.” but no all like that i m no make a majority.

I m 100% sure you make 2 server, 1 exp rate x1 other exp rate x20, i m sure hard core or not will go in exp x20, because hard core no existe, in 2015 is troll hard core, in hard core it have “hard”, but no a troll hard core will go in the low server rate because they are all troll, the hard core today want juste get a advantage on casu ppl for tell i m god.

#15

Sir, did you ever have to grind to go 161? genuine question.
Or if you just do all quests main and side quests and use the exp card in a normal manner you will progress eventually? or is it really necessary to grind at some point?

I understand that people try to save cards for the dead zone which is the 165+ and some says that is use to help you on the exp curves on lvl 46, 86 etc.

So if you just follow the quest, do everything then use the exp cards normally will you progress eventually and get to the 160/165 deadzone?

Thanks

#16

There needs to be a balance on exp. I’m not for nor am I against casual players. I don’t consider myself a casual but in terms of TIME and TIME only I suppose that I could be. Once upon a time I’d sit on my computer for hours a day multiple times a week. Now, I have a beautiful wife who wants to spend a lot of time with me and a son. I have a family that I love and video games just do not really have as much room as they used to. Thankfully, my wife also likes and is very good at games like this. Still…having a job and a family means that even though I was 14 when I started RO I’m going on 25 now and things are different.

That being said, the Hardcore/Casual debate is not always about time spent on the game. It’s about attitude. Casuals, and why we don’t really like them, find any and all reason to make the game easier, dumb it down, make it take less time to achieve the highest ranks, want to be able to afford everything, want to experience everything without working for it, the list goes on. Hardcore gamers are more interested in making the game feel more like real life. They want to earn what they get, they spend a long time working for it, they don’t expect their hands to be held, etc.

For example, new games have made it so that when someone asks you “Go find this thing I lost” the minimap has a big blinking flag, arrow, or dot to tell you exactly where it is. The hardest thing is when they just give you general circle area where to find the item. In old games, they might tell you something in the wording like “Go search this map” or “Find the place where a tree grows alone by a river” and it’s up to you to discover that place. You learn, you use your memory and your intellect to discover things. How do casual players experience any of this? They don’t. Casual players tend to want to experience many many “beginnings” of the game but don’t want to get invested. You don’t start a business or a relationship and expect that everything will happen for you in the very beginning, or that everything will be given to you easily and helpfully explained to your face. You deal with slow parts, you deal with frustrations, your work through problems, you find what works best for you through trial and error. Casual games do not feature this, and so it is annoying for those of us who are grown up and matured and want to invest our time and energy into something.

No, I don’t want to just throw myself as monsters for hours and hours a day when there are better things to do. But guess what: then I don’t expect to have the best gear or the first high level character! And when I do have time then I will invest it and hope to see results over time of my hard work. I don’t, as a person with maybe 2-4 hours of free time every few days, expect to be on the same level as those who don’t have anything else to do but play ToS, and I’m okay with that. There is nothing more intellectual about casual players or hardcore players to be honest. It’s all about the attitude, and time is not the biggest factor of success or failure.

8 Likes
#17

i understand, but the realy old scrool game can’t never be back, because is have internet with alot database on every game, by exemple ppl tell wow is easy because all use addon for rush the quest.
Useless you remove mini maps etc, in 3 monch every hide quest will be on internet with a guilde, when use exp card, what lvl you go that maps or another etc, true hard core game can’t never back all solution you will find on internet or youtube.

When ppl need a item or blocking first they go on internet, the game is no in open beta, you can also find alot bruilde ? you can’t make a game old scrool back.

Why old scrool game dead, the dev need add content every monch for ppl don’t out the game, only wow made that.
atm is close beta and you have a nice tosbase.com.

Now the true question Tos need make money, how get money with the internet world atm ? TOS need make ppl enjoy the game when juste play it, no try make a high ranked attrative for try save people, people get boring will juste leave, enjoy the game will play it and spent money that is simple.

Hard core peope or hard core game can’t existe, remember you “The Secret World” hard core in quest now what ? You want TOS survivre, forget make it hard core, no casu ppl = game dead because every game need money need casu.

Casu = money, Nexion loose too alot game who be hard core on lvling why ? Guilde wars 2 is casu and get alot million, ppl leave and back and leave and back, but spent money in Guilde wars 2, now dev have money for add content etc ?

If TOS don’t get money how do you want dev add content ? a litle ppl want hard core, but dev need money ? you want casu leave ? but you too, you will leave when the game will shut down.

Atm TOS is unique stype graphic oki ? for the looking first, people will go make a try, get boring will never back in, 2nd TOS is too easy, ppl enjoy and spend money, leave the game, the game get a new update content, player will back play TOS, because it enjoy the game, people leave and back but the game survie, first time ppl got boring, dev can make all update people will never back.

Exemple : 1 people invite you in a crazy patry you get boring 8h boring, he try invite you again you don’t will back, he can add more thing you will never back.

Exemple: 2 1 people invite you in a crazy party, you enjoy is good, but that patry is only for 2h duration, he invite you in a another patry you will go in, because you enjoy that patry.

Game is same.

#18

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

#19

I did have to grind at 132 I believe? That only took 2 days to get to the next exp curve, then while doing quests I jumped to 160 pretty fast. After that it’s a looong grind to 166 which is when I heard the next quests start to pick up. before that I recall grinding very little at some points. Nothing like a 3 to 4 day grind that I know i’m probably at right now. I just know that after killing a lot of stuff for an hour and only going up a few % points is very daunting.

1 Like
#20

I like your post but I am confused about the 1st sentence. Given your stance it seems that you are fine with the game, but you think there should be a balance on exp?

/confuzzled

#21

while doing quests you jumped to lv 160… then grinded to 166?
I hope you didnt use those lv7/8 exp cards early…lv175 and c6 will be far… very far.
Its best to save like 95-100% of them lv 7-8 cards and start popping at 165. Grind 140-165.

#22

Thanks goddess, at least one smart, wisdom people here.

#23

Yes, the internet will always “spoil” things for people. There have been guidebooks for games since games were invented. That doesn’t mean you have to access them. I beat all my N64 and PS2 RPG’s without using the Strategy Guides, but I still own them for the artwork and if I want to remember a monster name or something like that. Making it like old school games means that those people who want to cheat will cheat and those who want the genuine experience will do it that way. For some quests in RO I did have to use the guides I will admit, but others I figured out on my own. Like for example, that loooooong quest that’s like 80 something parts to it and it’s kind of random but it lets you get to the place where you fight Kiel Hyre (sp?) yeah I couldn’t figure that whole thing out without the guide, but once I got to certain steps I did the puzzles on my own. Let people with mature minds have the choice of operating that way and let those who need more assistance get it from the internet guides. There is no reason to say we cannot have it the “old” way just because some will spoil it. Now, it’s all spoiled and nobody has a choice for it to be different. Simply “turning off the minimap” doesn’t help either because the game isn’t designed for you to work that way. We don’t want to play with handicaps, we just want a genuine adventure.

From what I have seen of the game and heard, my first sentence from that last post is simply to say that there needs to exist a balance on exp so that each class can feel at home in some area and then everyone will eventually fight the same or similar mobs. That’s why I liked it in RO where we knew several different dungeons to go to based on what size of party you have and how good your gear is. I absolutely loved going to party in Abyss Dungeon (all of my exp is pre-renewal) with a full party. Then, eventually at some point the Nameless Island came out and we did full parties there. But, you needed decent gear and a high level. You could solo your way to 89 pretty well no matter what class you were (except Healers maybe…?) and then you had access to so many various places to level. We also did Magma Caves, Skeggiolds, Ice Caves, and a host of others. We always knew where to go at what level and how much it would cost you in potions to train there at that level. So many options for solo or party! You could even reach 99 solo if you wanted to, though it took more time of just mobbing…it was an option.

So they should choose the gameplay design that offers us the most options, making it hardcore friendly but allowing casual players the options to look at guides if they have to. Time spent should not be the only thing that separates us, so exp should be balanced in a way that people can level up and experience a lot, but people with more time to spend will obviously level up more.

Hey thanks lol I feel like I would be a really good game designer but I don’t want to draw and apparently that’s the only way you can get in…

#24

See my experience in RO was pre-any of that stuff. The fastest way to get to 99 was either GH or Turtle Island when that came out.

When I came back to RO years later and saw all these different leveling options it almost seemed casual-friendly. Nameless and Ice Titans were ridiculous EXP.

#25

Yeah, I know. I had several 99’s before a lot of that stuff came out but it was really fun once it did, and I changed servers multiple times too.

I remember raising Alchemist all the way to 99 way before Homunculus came out. I had such an awesome sword and shield agi build with plants everywhere it was just a lot of fun but a lot of work too.

GH and Turtles was honestly a little before my time. Not that I didn’t train at those places, just that when I started those were THE places to level and I think Reborns hadn’t even come out to our server yet. I was a nubb Paladin learning the game back then in your heyday. Truth be told I never really understood some of the new places and never even got in there. I thought they really opened it up and made it a whole new game with a new feeling. The cities were empty, the low level dungeons were empty, the random go-for-a-walk maps were empty. The only full places were 1 or 2 of the main cities and the super high level dungeons. That’s the fate of these games that cater too heavily to the casual style of gaming if you ask me, but I don’t blame RO considering it had been out for nearly a decade when it got to that point.

Edit: To get to 99 I think I mobbed Isis like crazy up in the Pyramids, I killed Anolians outside of the Seels map, there was the occasional trip to the Abyss for those of us who unlocked it, and otherwise maybe Bibilan 5…it’s been a long time but that should tell you about what time I was playing like maybe spring/summer 2004 is when I started.

#26

What was your IGN? At least on iRO chaos the GMs interviewed the first ten people who got to 99, and that all happened well after GH was released.

I ran as Remi-kun for the longest time as a wizard and then switched to a Crusader when secondary classes were released.

2 Likes
#27

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.